Blog Entry

Looking Back At the Sox, Marlins Trade!

Posted on: March 30, 2009 9:57 am
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 In November of 2005 the Boston Red Sox and Florida Marlins made a huge trade. At the time, Hanley Ramirez was just a prospect while Mike Lowell had just come off an injury plagued season and Josh Beckett was one of better pitchers in baseball. Years later the Sox find themselves struggling at shortstop but striving with an ace of Josh Beckett. The Sox have won the World Series with both Lowell and Beckett and Lowell did manage to win World Series MVP.

Hanley Ramirez is now being picked number one overall in fantasy baseball leagues and is one of if not the best player in all of baseball. He plays a position in which most teams struggle at and he manages to hit .300+ with 35+ SB and 100+ runs. He has stolen 51 SB twice in his 3 year long career. No doubt any team would want this guy to play SS for them.

Most would argue that the Sox wouldn't have won the Series in 07' without Lowell and Beckett and I would have to agree. Although you could also argue that the Sox might have still one it with only Hanley because he is just that good. Either way you look at it the Sox would have had a great team but we know for a fact that that Beckett and Lowell both helped them win it all.

I wonder who has the better deal as of now. Some would have to say it is the Marlins because they have such a great player and the Sox have Lowell who is battling back problems at the age of 35 and doesn't have much left in the tank. Josh Beckett only at the age of 28 is still pretty young and is one of the best pitchers in the league. Yes the Sox need Beckett but couldn't they still be very good without him? They have a great young pitcher in Jon Lester and the Japan sensation Dice-k. They also picked up John Smoltz, and Brad Penny who could be a sleeper this year. Not to mention good Ol' Tim Wakefield and young Clay Bucholtz who has thrown a no-hitter in the Bigs.

They have Jed Lowrie who is a good young player but could play third if they still Hanley. That would mean a huge upgrade a shortstop. A small down grade at third with Lowrie instead of Lowell. The starting rotation would be: Lester, Dice-k, Wakefield, Penny, and Bucholtz. That is an OK starting rotation and you could also move Justin Masterson from the bullpen to the rotation if you felt it would be better.

With that being said I would love to have Hanley Ramirez, but Mike Lowell is still a good third basemen and Beckett is an ace that can carry your team in the playoffs. I would have to say the Sox have a better team with Lowell and Beckett instead of Hanley. This is one of the fairest trades I have seen though. Both sides got great player(s). Although once Lowell retires then the Marlins will have the better players left but that doesn't make up for the hardware the trade brought Boston.

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Comments

Since: Feb 2, 2008
Posted on: March 31, 2009 6:54 pm
 

Looking Back At the Sox, Marlins Trade!

 

 I hated this trade when they made it and i still hate it now. Even Theo Epstien has said he wouldnt have doen this trade (the trade was made when he left the team and his assistent took over). Everyone knew Hanley was gonna be great. Boston would have gotten another high end starter somewhere else. You dont trade trade a decade + of Hanley Ramirez for a couple good seasons of Josh Beckett (hes only really had one good season in Boston so far) and hes already declining. I love Josh Beckett but i just think they could have gotten someone else another way. They are the Red Sox they have plenty of resources.I remember going to Pawsox games and watching Hanley. I am dying for them to get Hanley back but i know it willl never happen.




Since: Nov 2, 2006
Posted on: March 31, 2009 4:16 pm
 

Looking Back At the Sox, Marlins Trade!

You are right bayinighthehound the questionable deal with Julio Lugo most definately had the Red Sox wanted Hanley Ramirez back but you have to look at the big picture and that is the fact the Sox won a world championship with Beckett and Lowell and they collectively probably would've added more than Hanley would have by himself.

Mike Lowell has performed well above expectations as a starter at third base and though i doubt the Red Sox will keep him past his current contract i don't particularly worry because we have an exciting rookie coming up.  That rookie being 1st baseman Lars Anderson who is like 6'4 220 with alot of power and Kevin Youkilis can switch to third in the process.  The only real question is how ready is Lars and will he get a call up this season to get a quick taste of the major leagues?

Beckett was worth trading for in my opinion because when he is on he is a flat out ace and although health has been a concern i think if he can stay healthy he could easily win 20 games again and the World Series.  I think with premium pitching being the hardest thing to find if you have the chance to trade a position player for an Ace you take that deal any day of the week.

Still though, i wouldn't mind at all if the Red Sox re-aquired hanley back, and if the Marlins are out of the race by the deadline i could see the Sox making another push for him.

 

 




Since: Jul 30, 2008
Posted on: March 31, 2009 11:32 am
 

Looking Back At the Sox, Marlins Trade!

Red Sox won in the deal because they won 2 World Series after a long drought. Beckett is still young at 28 as well. Hanley was the best player overall that was dealt but beckett and lowell > Hanley for the years since the trade. Great trade for both teams.




Since: Aug 4, 2008
Posted on: March 31, 2009 10:31 am
 

Looking Back At the Sox, Marlins Trade!

 You could argue both teams got a great deal from this trade, the red sox consiquently winning the world series led by Josh Beckett and the Marlins getting the best player in baseball, but if you're looking at the trade right now, clearly the Marlins got a better deal out of this by far.

Hanley Ramirez is an absolute beast, just think what the Red Sox lineup would be with Hanley patrolling shortstop. Their pitching is so deep as well all they would have to do is move everyone up a spot if Beckett wasn't there. Lester is number 1, dice-k 2 and have bucholz the number 5. The Red Sox would no doubt be the team to beat with Hanley Ramirez right now.




Since: Aug 8, 2008
Posted on: March 31, 2009 9:51 am
 

Looking Back At the Sox, Marlins Trade!

What are the three things you need in the playoffs to win (besides getting there)?  Pitching, defense, and timely hitting.  This is a no-brainer.  The Sox got the better end of this deal, period.  Hanley can go on to have a Hall of Fame career, and then it becomes at worst a push as a trade.  You can always find positional players (especially if you're willing to pay for them).  You do not win in baseball without great pitching.  And although his numbers when you look at them as a whole over the 3 years aren't great...Josh Beckett was GREAT in 2007.  Throw in Mike Lowell in this deal (because he was terrible in '05 and his contract was too big for the Marlins) and then look at his numbers since he joined the club, and it's a win for the Sox.  He's been GREAT in the field (and by all accounts in the clubhouse as well), and has been, all in all, a very good hitter while in Boston.  Throw in the fact that Hanley may end up in the outfield, and you got two players that gave you all 3 components to winning in the postseason for a guy who could be a monster (but may end up anywhere between really, really good, and good) and a potentially very good pitcher in Anibel Sanchez, if his arm isn't shot.

Short term, no-brainer a win for the Sox.

Long term, at worse a push.




Since: Mar 18, 2008
Posted on: March 31, 2009 12:33 am
 

Looking Back At the Sox, Marlins Trade!

Yes the trade helped both teams, but you play for the NOW...so Boston gets the edge since they won the Series.  Who knows Sox fans, you might see Hanley in a Boston uni in a couple of years when the Marlins hold another fire sale.

 




Since: Mar 30, 2009
Posted on: March 30, 2009 9:10 pm
 

Looking Back At the Sox, Marlins Trade!

This was a quick fix for the sox and it worked, but I think after the Lugo fiasco they would like to have Hanley back

 




Since: Jan 15, 2008
Posted on: March 30, 2009 8:28 pm
 

Looking Back At the Sox, Marlins Trade!

Very fair deal

But I think the Marlins got the slight edge b/c Hanley is young and has quickly became the bet SS in the league

Beckett is very good, but 2 great years and now he's slowing, and Lowell is ok

 




Since: Nov 19, 2008
Posted on: March 30, 2009 7:16 pm
 

Looking Back At the Sox, Marlins Trade!

 And Beckett well, he is no Roger like everyone thought.

 

 

I for one am glad that he's not Roger. I'll take his attitude and his postseason results over Clemens all day long. Plus I'm betting he doesn't CHEAT.

I'm thinking most here in RSN would do this trade again since it brought a World Series Championship to the team. I don't think there is any way that they win without Lowell or Beckett. One in the Nation who might not have done the trade is Theo. If you remember this trade was consummated while Theo was on hiatus in his gorilla suit. He is always hesitant to trade a top-tier prospect and Ramirez was just that with the Sox.

A couple things do bother me long-term with Ramirez though. It appears that he may not be a shortstop for many more years as there are concerns with range and general fielding acumen. Many see him as a centerfielder as he takes the same route as Robin Yount did with the Brewers. Hope it works out as well. He is still a great player as a centerfielder but some of the specialness wears off if he is not a shortstop. He posts special numbers as a SS.

I also have a problem with some of the attitude issues that I have heard and read about. Word was that he and Miguel Cabrera were always out on the town and that was one of the reasons that Cabrera was moved. This thing with the hair and requesting a trade that happened recently makes one question his maturity. I realize he has rescinded the demand but to be that impulsive and selfish raises questions about his make-up in my mind.

Even if Lowell doesn't get all the way back his presence through the professionalism and class that Pedroia, Youkilis, Ellsbury, and the other young Sox players have watched him exhibit during his time here will have a long lasting effect on the organization. Maybe Jay Cutler should check out Mike Lowell to see how a professional acts.

Bottom line. Do this trade every day. Beckett is not done and he can carry this team through the playoffs again. I don't believe that's true of Ham-Ram, until he proves me wrong. Team before individual and I don't see Ramirez buying into that, yet.




Since: Feb 24, 2007
Posted on: March 30, 2009 6:38 pm
 

Looking Back At the Sox, Marlins Trade!

I agree with Hunterja5. The Marlins in the long run better only if they keep him for his contract term and build from here now that they have a stadium agreement. The Sox though still got a good fielding Third baseman, just sucks he can't stay health. And Beckett well, he is no Roger like everyone thought. But he might come out this season and throw lights out. Isn't he 29 now? Is 29 the year pitchers become great?  



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