Blog Entry

Conference Debates: SEC and Big 10

Posted on: August 24, 2009 2:56 pm
 

Many of you might ask why I would even bother putting something like this together.  You might ask this because in your mind, the SEC is very much superior to the Big Ten and there is really no comparison.  Heck, most would rate the SEC being better than all conferences in college football.  Well to all who think this, continue reading.  I think you might find much of this interesting, and more importantly eye opening.

The primary reason I did this is because of all the Big Ten doubters out there.  This all started recently, mainly due to Ohio State winning Big 10 championships, then losing some high profile post-season games as of late.  I don’t know if anyone realizes it or not, but every program has experienced what Ohio State has went through the past several seasons.  I will be the first to agree the past few seasons haven’t been great for Big 10 teams.  This is nothing new to college football, but Ohio State and the Big Ten are taking a lot of heat from it.  My question is why all of this heat?  Do people really hate Ohio State and the Big Ten this much, or is it something else?  If it is hate, I have to ask why?  Florida and LSU fans should actually love Ohio State, right?  Heck, Ohio State gave Florida two national titles, one in football and then the following year in basketball.  Gator Nation should absolutely love the Buckeyes.  That’s three total national titles Ohio State has surrendered to teams from the SEC.  And to top it off, Ohio State is 0-9 in bowl games against teams from the SEC.  SEC country should absolutely love the Buckeyes.  Yet much of the trash talk and hate come from SEC country.  I just can’t seem to comprehend this.  The 0-9 record doesn’t really bother me all that much.  Ohio State has accomplished a heck of a lot more outside of those nine games.

Throughout college football history, the SEC and Big Ten have been college football’s best performing leagues to date.  Is there really that much difference between the two?   Most people would say there’s a huge difference, especially within the top few teams in each league.  I don’t know where these people are coming from, because although there is a difference, I say there’s not really that much of a difference, and I will prove it later on in this blog.  Most college football fans (especially those who post here) are stuck in the age of the BCS, so I’ll honor that.  I will agree with anyone who says it, the SEC has had much success when it comes to BCS national championships during the BCS era.  The programs that have made the SEC standout the most have been Florida and LSU for their multiple BCS national titles.  Tennessee has also won a BCS title, and was the first ever to do so.  Auburn probably should have been provided an AP title during the BCS era as well with their undefeated season back in 2004.  This individual success has given the perception that the SEC is superior to any league, when in reality this is not the case.  I’m not trying to take away what LSU, Auburn, Tennessee and Florida have accomplished during the BCS era, because winning a national title, or in the case of Auburn, going a season undefeated is phenomenal.  During the BCS era, 12 teams from 10 different conferences have recorded undefeated seasons.  That, to me, is incredible.  Only one program has recorded more than one undefeated season, and that program is Utah.  Way to go Utes!  Yet they were not awarded a national championship in either of those fantastic seasons.  Auburn and Tennessee are the two programs from the SEC to have an undefeated season since 1998, and Ohio State from the Big Ten has one as well.  Seven were awarded a national championship, while the other five were left wondering:  Boise State, Utah, Marshall, Auburn and Tulane.  Between 1998 and 2004, every BCS conference had a team credited with a BCS national championship.  The SEC is credited with four titles in the last six seasons, and five overall.  While that is a tremendous accomplishment, is it fair to say the SEC was the best conference in each of those seasons an SEC team won the title?  If so, then it should also be fair to say that in 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2004 and 2005, the SEC was not the best conference in college football.  Another way to look at it is the SEC was not the best in six of eleven seasons.  The point I’m trying to make is just because a team wins the title, the conference it’s affiliated with isn’t necessarily the best.  On the flip-side, the team who loses to the eventual national champ doesn’t necessarily belong to the nation’s worst conference either.  There is no realistic or objective way to determine which conference is best, or the worst and how all the rest in between stack up.  (Please read the previous sentence one more time) Nope, bowl games are not an accurate measurement either.  There is absolutely no realistic or objective way to make a determination of who is best and who isn’t, because they all don’t play the same opponents throughout a given season.  All there is is opinion…and we sure see a lot of that here.  But, there is something else we have…statistics.  Statistics are factual, so let’s look at some.  Please keep in mind that these statistics are BCS era stats, since a majority of the fans consider this the most important part of the history of college football.  We can look at all-time stats if the majority wants to, but I can tell you right now the results won't change all that much.

I will use the top four teams in each conference to make this comparison.  These teams were determined based on their in-conference performance since 1998.  I was really hoping Alabama would be in this mix, but they've had a tough decade for the most part.  They're coming back, and I'm glad for that.  Alabama is a great program.

Top 4 teams in each conference during BCS era:  Bolded stats are best stats out of groups, italicized stats are ties.

Florida             Overall record:  106-35 (.752)
Record versus season-ranked opponents:  33-30 (.524)
Record versus OOC opponents:  36-13 (.735)
Record versus season-ranked OOC opponents:  9-13 (.409)
Record versus OOC BCS conference opponents: 12-13 (.480)
Record versus non-BCS opponents:  24-0 (1.000)

Georgia           Overall record:  107-33 (.764)
Record versus season-ranked opponents:  22-28 (.440)
Record versus OOC opponents:  43-6 (.878)
Record versus season-ranked OOC opponents:  10-6 (.625)
Record versus OOC BCS conference opponents:  20-6 (.769)
Record versus non-BCS opponents:  23-0 (1.000)

Tennessee       Overall record:  98-41 (.705)
Record versus season-ranked opponents:  22-31 (.415)
Record versus OOC opponents:  36-11 (.766)
Record versus season-ranked OOC opponents:  7-7 (.500)
Record versus OOC BCS conference opponents: 12-10 (.545)
Record versus non-BCS opponents:  24-1 (.960)

LSU                  Overall record:  97-42 (.698)
Record versus season-ranked opponents:  25-28 (.472)
Record versus OOC opponents:  41-6 (.872)
Record versus season-ranked OOC opponents:  8-4 (.667)
Record versus OOC BCS conference opponents:  12-4 (.750)
Record versus non-BCS opponents:  29-2 (.935)

 

Ohio State       Overall record:  108-30 (.783)
Record versus season-ranked opponents:  25-22 (.532)
Record versus OOC opponents:  41-9 (.820)
Record versus season-ranked OOC opponents:  8-8 (.500)
Record versus OOC BCS conference opponents:  17-9 (.654)
Record versus non-BCS opponents:  24-0 (1.000)

Michigan         Overall record:  96-41 (.701)
Record versus season-ranked opponents:  23-28 (.451)
Record versus OOC opponents:  31-18 (.633)
Record versus season-ranked OOC opponents:  6-12 (.333)
Record versus OOC BCS conference opponents: 12-15 (.444)
Record versus non-BCS opponents:  19-3 (.864)

Wisconsin       Overall record:  97-43 (.693)
Record versus season-ranked opponents:  16-27 (.372)
Record versus OOC opponents:  44-8 (.846)
Record versus season-ranked OOC opponents:  7-4 (.636)
Record versus OOC BCS conference opponents:  15-5 (.750)
Record versus non-BCS opponents:  29-3 (.906)

Penn State          Overall record:  85-50 (.630)
Record versus season-ranked opponents:  15-32 (.319)
Record versus OOC opponents:  36-11 (.766)
Record versus season-ranked OOC opponents:  6-6 (.500)
Record versus OOC BCS conference opponents: 17-10 (.630)
Record versus non-BCS opponents:  19-1 (.950)

 SEC TOTALS        Overall record:  408-151 (.730)
Record versus season-ranked opponents:  102-117 (.466)
Record versus OOC opponents:  156-36 (.813)
Record versus season-ranked OOC opponents:  34-30 (.531)
Record versus OOC BCS conference opponents: 56-33 (.629)
Record versus non-BCS opponents:  100-3 (.971)

BIG 10 TOTALS   Overall record:  386-164 (.702)
Record versus season-ranked opponents:  79-109 (.420)
Record versus OOC opponents:  152-46 (.768)
Record versus season-ranked OOC opponents:  27-30 (.474)
Record versus OOC BCS conference opponents: 61-39 (.610)
Record versus non-BCS opponents:  91-7 (.929)


HEAD-TO-HEAD RESULTS (vs. top 4 Big 10 teams)

 

Florida:                 1-2 (.333)

Georgia:               1-0 (1.000)

Tennessee:           2-1 (.667)

LSU:                     1-0 (1.000)

SEC top 4 vs. Big 10 top 4:  5-3

HEAD-TO-HEAD RESULTS (vs. top 4 SEC teams)

Ohio State           0-2 (.000)

Michigan              2-1 (.667)

Wisconsin            0-2 (.000)

Penn State          1-0 (1.000)

Big 10 top 4 vs. SEC top 4: 3-5


* SEC teams finished a season ranked 54 times (avg 4.9 teams per year)  * Top-to-bottom and taken from Coaches Poll


Average Ranking 1998-2008

Florida                  12.91

Georgia                12.36

Tennessee            21.09

LSU                     19.18


* Big 10 teams finished a season ranked 45 times (avg 4.1 teams per year)

Average Ranking 1998-2008

Ohio State           12.64

Michigan              17.55

Wisconsin            23.82

Penn State          25.64


* Big 10 teams finished in the top ten 20 times (avg 1.8 teams per year)

* SEC teams finished in the top ten 23 times (avg 2.1 teams per year)

SEC Number of times finishing ranked in top ten 1998-2008 (18)

Florida                  4

Georgia                6

Tennessee            3

LSU                      5

Alabama and Auburn finished 3 and 2 times respectively


Big 10 Number of times finishing ranked in top 10 1998-2008 (16)

Ohio State           6

Michigan              5

Wisconsin            3

Penn State          2

Iowa and Michigan State finished 3 and 1 times respectively


SEC top-to-bottom

Record versus season-ranked OOC opponents:  44-71 (.383)

Record versus Big 10 season-ranked opponents:  10-14 (.417)

Overall record versus Big 10: 20-18 (.526)

Overall record versus ACC:  47-36 (.566)

Overall record versus Big 12: 20-17 (.541)

Overall record versus Big East: 9-18 (.333)

Overall record versus PAC 10: 7-10 (.412)

Total versus ACC, Big 12, Big East, PAC 10: 83-81 (.506)

Overall bowl record:  50-35 (.588)

Team with best bowl record (minimum 6 bowl games):  Ole Miss (5-1)

Team with most bowl wins:  Georgia (9)

Bowl record versus Big 10:  14-15 (.483)

Bowl record versus ACC:  15-4 (.789)

Bowl record versus Big 12:  15-8 (.652)

Bowl record versus Big East:  1-6 (.143)

Bowl record versus PAC 10:  None played

Overall bowl game record versus BCS teams:  45-33 (.577)

Bowl games versus Notre Dame:  1-0 (1.000)

Bowl games versus non-BCS teams:  4-2 (.667)

Big 10 top-to-bottom

Record versus season-ranked OOC opponents:  37-75 (.330)

Record versus SEC season-ranked opponents:  11-13 (.458)

Overall record versus SEC:  18-20 (.474)

Overall record versus ACC:  15-12 (.556)

Overall record versus Big 12: 21-26 (.447)

Overall record versus Big East: 22-11 (.667)

Overall record versus PAC 10: 24-34 (.414)

Total versus ACC, Big 12, Big East, PAC 10: 82-83 (.497)

Overall bowl record:  34-40 (.459)

Team with best bowl record (minimum 6 bowl games):  Penn State (5-2)

Team with most bowl wins:  Wisconsin (6)

Bowl record versus SEC:  15-14 (.517)

Bowl record versus ACC:  2-5 (.286)

Bowl record versus Big 12:  8-10 (.444)

Bowl record versus Big East:  1-0 (1.000)

Bowl record versus PAC 10:  5-10 (.333)

Overall bowl game record versus BCS teams:  31-39 (.443)

Bowl games versus Notre Dame:  1-0 (1.000)

Bowl games versus non-BCS teams:  2-1 (.667)


Based on these stats, I agree the SEC performed slightly better overall.  I was actually very surprised how close some of the stats were.  I personally have nothing against the SEC, and I actually admire and respect many of its programs.  I can never understand it when someone takes out all of their frustration on Ohio State.  In my opinion, it is just not deserved.  However, it is an individuals right to speak what they think.  I just don't understand the thinking sometimes.  The stats that stand out the most for me is the fact Ohio State has performed better against season-ranked opponents...better than any SEC team, yet Ohio State is constantly criticized for failing to perform in big games.  OSU is 5th nationally in winning percentage versus season-ranked top 25 opponents.  There is no SEC team above them in that category.  It's irrelevant OSU is 0-2 against the top 4 SEC teams since 1998.  Those teams happened to claim national championships, and Ohio State happened to be the runner-up.  My other blog titled "The Oklahoma and Ohio State Predicament" pretty much explains how I feel in general regarding the subject.  The fact of the matter is, when it comes to accomplishments, the Big 10 is not far behind the SEC during the BCS era.  There is much more to a college football season, and to college football history than the one game a season to determine a national champion.  Ohio State has won their fair share of conference and national titles, as well as a host of other great programs.  It would be nice if people just showed a little bit of fansmanship, and give credit where credit is due.  Although there have been some tough losses the past few seasons for my beloved Buckeyes, they have held their own overall...and will continue to do so.  For the haters (besides the Michigan haters, because we battle every season), what are you going to do when my beloved Buckeyes beat your favorite team?  It's going to happen one day.  What then?

Category: NCAAF
Comments

Since: Nov 30, 2009
Posted on: November 30, 2009 10:06 pm
 

Conference Debates: SEC and Big 10

the big ten is better than the sec as of alltime. yall r better rite now but that dosent mean u guys  better of alltime thats bullcrap we got 39 national championships yall have 25 wow thats a huge gap boy shut it




Since: Apr 24, 2009
Posted on: October 8, 2009 10:24 am
 

Conference Debates: SEC and Big 10

silver bullet come back to my thread today, you have been officially owned for NOT READING.



Since: Mar 4, 2008
Posted on: September 13, 2009 4:07 am
 

Conference Debates: SEC and Big 10

I think that is great research. Excellent work. I agree that the SEC is better right now but as everything is, it is blown out of proportion. Also 2 things of note....1)the SEC does not travel to big name colleges outside of the south 2)the bowl games they play in are usually in SEC country, and you can say what you want about splitting tics...but it is their home turf, the whole ambience of the city is for them whether it is New Orleans, Miami, or Tampa. Not to diminish what those teams have done but I would like to see a little more risk taking in their scheduling. Most of the time it's not even a weak FBS school, it's an FCS. And the BCS is basically set up to be the SEC Champ against best of the rest so you're only asking an SEC team to win 1 game outside of it's comfort zone (if the bowl game's out west), or none at all.   Credit the Buckeyes for this at least...who else has traveled  to Texas and USC in the past 8 years??



Since: Sep 7, 2008
Posted on: September 6, 2009 1:34 am
 

Conference Debates: SEC and Big 10

It seems like most of these guys have only been watching college football over the past 5 years which explains why they are clueless re: your post.  If anything, "All knowing" seems to be making a case for the need of increased birth control in the state of South Carolina....



Since: Jun 10, 2009
Posted on: August 27, 2009 7:02 pm
 

Conference Debates: SEC and Big 10

Knownothing he owned you with facts and all you can do is pull the Individuals don't matter card?  I expect better from the CFB God.



Since: Aug 24, 2009
Posted on: August 26, 2009 1:20 pm
 

Conference Debates: SEC and Big 10

WHo cares in the LAST 70 YEARS !!! All we care ABOUT Is ALL TIME, and ALL TIME THE BIG ten wins....NEXT.

poor, fake allknowing. I"M a CFB Posting GOD!



Since: Jan 12, 2009
Posted on: August 26, 2009 1:18 pm
 

Conference Debates: SEC and Big 10

poor sliver, he now is condensing it down to the loser cat. The one where only one player matters not all 86. TEAMS WIN, not hall of fame WINS. LOL Poor guy you are just toooooo easy to make look silly.



Since: Apr 14, 2008
Posted on: August 26, 2009 10:12 am
 

Conference Debates: SEC and Big 10

It sure would be nice if some particular people would actually read a blog before revealing themselves as a total fool.  The BCS era is used in many debates occurring in college football forums and in media presentations, so this is why I chose the time frame.  No need to make ridiculous comments in response unless the comments are meaningful to the readers.  The stats used in the blog are factual for the time period presented, and the period of time used is definitely relevant (BCS era).  

The real reason I came back to this blog was because I thought of something to add that I thought might be interesting to many fans. I knew Ohio State, Michigan, Alabama and Tennessee had quite a few great players who have been inducted into the College Football Hall of Fame, but was interested in how many players the other teams have put in over the years.  So, in light of the blog, I decided to look up how many Hall of Fame players each of these two great conferences have produced.  I was surprised at how many great players from these conferences have been inducted into the Hall.

SEC:  90
B10:  136

Tennessee leads the SEC with 20, while Michigan leads the Big 10 with 26.  Congrats to the '09 inductees:

Alabama's Woodrow Lowe (LB 72-75)
Auburn's Ed Dyas (FB 58-60)
Penn State's Curt Warner (RB 79-82)
Ohio State's Chris Spielman (LB 84-87)
Iowa's Larry Station (82-85)
  



Since: Jan 12, 2009
Posted on: August 25, 2009 9:15 pm
 

Conference Debates: SEC and Big 10

funny you should ask since the SEC since BEING CREATED In 1933 has more national titles than the big ten since BEING CREATED, any title before the ap came out are laughing joke titles. Modern era, I know the big ten hates the modern era.  ALSO what is even funnier is every decade since 1950 we have more titles than you. STUCK in the 1900s to the 1940s 10. NICE NAME, fits you perfect.



Since: Feb 4, 2007
Posted on: August 25, 2009 7:45 pm
 

Conference Debates: SEC and Big 10

And how many does south carolina have?


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