Blog Entry

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

Posted on: September 4, 2011 3:53 pm
Edited on: September 4, 2011 8:54 pm
Bryan Petersen
Charlie ManuelBy C. Trent Rosecrans

The Phillies finished Sunday's 5-4 loss to the Marlins in 14 innings under protest, following an instant replay review that may have cost the Phillies two runs in the sixth inning.

The protest came after umpire Joe West (who else?) used instant replay to review fans Hunter Pence double in the top of the sixth inning. After reviewing the play, Pence was called out on fan interference. Pence's ball was hit to right field, where Florida's Bryan Petersen lept to try to catch the ball, but instead a fan in a green shirt and another in a Phillies jersey and hat, leaned over the railing to try to catch the ball. The ball bounced off the fan in green's hand, just above Petersen's glove, then bounced off the outstretched hat and into the corner in right, giving Pence a double and allowing Ryan Howard to get to third.

As soon as West reviewed the play and announced Pence was out, Phillies manager Charlie Manuel argued and was ejected. In all, the delay lasted 13 minutes, with not only Manuel arguing, but also bench coach Pete Mackanin arguing it as well. Their argument was that fan interference isn't one of the approved uses of replay.

"If they wanted to see if it was for a defense play, I didn't think you could do that," Manuel told reporters (News Journal). "My understanding is that's not the rule." 

The fan clearly interfered with the ball, so ultimately it was the correct call. ESPN's Steve Berthiaume spoke with former Major League umpire Jim McKean, who told him that once the umpires decided to review whether it was a home run, the umpires could then use their judgement to rule on fan interference (Twitter).

According to the rule, the umpire can use his "sole discretion" in determining the use of replay, though Joe West told reporters the umpires were reviewing the home run (a charge Manuel denied), but that home plate umpire Chad Fairchild believed there was fan interference on the play. The second part of the matter was that the umpires ruled Pence out -- the Phillies outfielder didn't quite agree that Petersen was definitely making the catch.

"I'm going to say it's one of the best plays of the week if he makes it," Pence said (News Journal). 

Said Petersen: "I honestly don't know what happened. I thought I was going to catch the ball." (Sun-Sentinel)

The next Phillies batter after Pence, Raul Ibanez, doubled, which would have scored both Pence and Howard. Instead, after an intentional walk to load the bases, Wilson Valdez grounded into a double play to end the inning.

The Marlins then took the lead with a run in the bottom of the sixth inning with a run off of Roy Halladay.

Since the Phillies lost the game, Joe Torre will review the appeal. If Torre agrees the umpire erred, the game would be replayed from that at-bat -- but without Manuel, who was ejected. Here's a list of protested games that were later resumed, including, of course, the Pine Tar Game. No protest game has been replayed from the point of pretest since 1986 in a game between the Cardinals and Pirates.

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Since: Mar 15, 2008
Posted on: September 5, 2011 11:36 am

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

Phillies cry me a river. You only have the best record in the majors. Talk to me if you actually lose the playoff race.

Since: Sep 5, 2011
Posted on: September 5, 2011 11:26 am

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

I don't understand how MLB allows this crew to stay together or Joe West to be an umpire.This group seems to make the news on a consistent basis and this web page had labelled them the worst crew back in July. Joe West  clearly reviewed a hit that was initially scored a double and neither team asked for a review to see if it was a homerun. The Marlins asked about the fan interference and since the first base ump ( who has the physique of a 50year old bar fly and just happened to also be, Joe West )never ran out to rightfield on the play because he can't run more than 15 ft without losing his breath. So now MLB can use instant review to make up for their officials who ar fat, lazy and incompetent? This crew and at least Joe West last year was also involved in a couple of non-reviews when one of the teams requested a review and Joe West and his crew felt that it was not warrented (one of those made sportscenter last summer as a clear homerun that was ruled a foul.) This crew needs to be broken up and some of them should find a new career.

Since: Aug 21, 2006
Posted on: September 5, 2011 11:07 am

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

The protest came after umpire Joe West (who else?) used instant replay to review fans double in the top of the sixth inning.

Ummm, does this make sense to anyone else? Because I have no idea what this is supposed to mean.

Since: Sep 5, 2011
Posted on: September 5, 2011 10:10 am

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

And Chollie said he didn't ask for an HR review, so how does west review? Completely wrong use of reply under the rule

Since: Aug 31, 2011
Posted on: September 5, 2011 9:45 am

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

Poor Phillies. WTF is a Phillie anyhow?

Since: Aug 25, 2006
Posted on: September 5, 2011 9:35 am

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

The next Phillies batter after Pence, , doubled, which would have scored both Pence and Howard.
How can you be a professional baseball writer and write something as naive as that? I hate when people say this sort of thing. If Pence had been granted the double, the Marlins probably would have pitched Ibanez differently. They may have intentional walked him or changed pitchers. Go back to journalism school.

Since: Sep 27, 2007
Posted on: September 5, 2011 8:30 am

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

BRAVES_ROCK1, This is very well written and explained and also thoroughly correct. If the Phillies didn't ask for a review to try and get the call changed from a double to a Home Run then the play never should have been reviewed. The Umpires screwed up and now it's time for the league to step up and admit it and correct this wrong doing by the umpires (even though the call ended up being correct).

Also. your comparison is also correct, the only problem is if that actually happened, the refs would definitely review the play anyway even if Belicheat was out of timeouts. Everyone knows there's a seperate rule book for the Patriots then the rest of the league. Come on, How does Albert Haynesworth not get suspended when he pleads guilty to a criminal offense but Terelle Pryor gets suspended for something he did in college, ABSOLUTELY BOGUS and DEFINITELY FAVORING THE PATRIOTS. 

Since: Aug 16, 2006
Posted on: September 5, 2011 7:00 am

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

After the game, West told reporters, who tracked him down in the parking lot, that Manuel asked him to review the call to see if it was a home run, while McKeon wanted interference. West said that once replay happens, "we must use all evidence" to make a determination.

Read more: 

Since: Feb 16, 2011
Posted on: September 5, 2011 2:54 am

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

Lost in all the hubbub over whether the umpire should, or should not, have utilized instant replay in this particular situation is the fact that (as best I can tell from the photograph leading this article) there had to be no fewer than 28 fans in attendance at a Florida Marlins home game -- this being on a sultry September afternoon . . . and, with those 28 fans being situated in the outfield seats (where usually a spectator enjoys the luxury of having an entire section of Sun Life Stadium to themselves), that likely means there were possibly a few hundred more people located in the areas behind home plate and along the base lines.  The box score for Sunday's game reports the crowd was 21,234 . . . sure, if they're including stadium employees, team personnel, and anybody who might have been on the other end of a cellphone call or recipient of a text message originating from someone actually AT the game. 

Since: Aug 26, 2010
Posted on: September 5, 2011 2:38 am

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

The umpires decided to look at the replay to see if the ball was a homerun or if it hit the wall.
And who told them to go to video replay? It wasn't Charlie. So you're going to say... "Well, the umps can video replay any play they feel is close to being a homer." Okay... but here's a question... have you been watching baseball for more than say... a day? Have you ever seen an ump go to video replay without the team that hit the apparent homer ask for it? Heck... most of the time I've seen questionable calls on homers, the umps often REFUSE to go to instant replay. I've seen it at least a few times just with Charlie questioning it... which has always pissed me off, when they won't even give him the time of day to review the replay.

Once they decided to see if the ball was a homerun or not they can then look to see if there was fan interference.
Yeah... we get that... but the review was basically asked for by the Marlins... which everyone knows is against MLB current regluations, and thus the Phillies protest.

West was NEVER looking to see if this ball was a home run... he was looking to see if it was fan interference (which it was)... but is besides the point because it's not reviewable IF the Phillies didn't ask for a review. Do you think the Marlin's requested a video review... to question whether or not the Phillies should have actually got a homer instead of the double? Come on now.

The gist of this whole thing... they reviewed something that should not have been reviewed... PERIOD.

Now... let's pretend this is week one of the NFL... and your Dolphins are beating the Patriots by 2 with 2:10 left on the clock. Brady is driving the Patriots and has them down to the 25 yard line and the Dolphins are all out of timeouts. During the next running play the Patriots fumble near the sideline and lose the ball. Luckily for the Patriots the Dolphin that made the recovery stepped out of bounds and it should be the Patriots ball again with a first down. After seeing the replay on the big screen, Belicheat then grabs and throws his red flag for video review... but wait... he's all out of challenges. The refs then proceed to review the play anyway, saying they needed to review the play because they wanted to know where to spot the ball. They then give the ball back to the Patriots, who go down and kick the winning field goal as time expires.

Are you telling me you'd be okay with that? Because that's the equivalent of what happened to the Phillies today. They are NOT ALLOWED to review a play for fan interference unless it is seen when they are reviewing a homer or non-homer that was questioned by the offense. The Phillies did NOT ask for the replay... the Marlins did.

Why is this so hard for people?

By the way... I'd rather have video replay for when things like this happen... but it's bull for the rules to not even be in effect and still get burned by it.

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