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Phillies protest loss to Marlins

Posted on: September 4, 2011 3:53 pm
Edited on: September 4, 2011 8:54 pm
 
Bryan Petersen
Charlie ManuelBy C. Trent Rosecrans

The Phillies finished Sunday's 5-4 loss to the Marlins in 14 innings under protest, following an instant replay review that may have cost the Phillies two runs in the sixth inning.

The protest came after umpire Joe West (who else?) used instant replay to review fans Hunter Pence double in the top of the sixth inning. After reviewing the play, Pence was called out on fan interference. Pence's ball was hit to right field, where Florida's Bryan Petersen lept to try to catch the ball, but instead a fan in a green shirt and another in a Phillies jersey and hat, leaned over the railing to try to catch the ball. The ball bounced off the fan in green's hand, just above Petersen's glove, then bounced off the outstretched hat and into the corner in right, giving Pence a double and allowing Ryan Howard to get to third.

As soon as West reviewed the play and announced Pence was out, Phillies manager Charlie Manuel argued and was ejected. In all, the delay lasted 13 minutes, with not only Manuel arguing, but also bench coach Pete Mackanin arguing it as well. Their argument was that fan interference isn't one of the approved uses of replay.

"If they wanted to see if it was for a defense play, I didn't think you could do that," Manuel told reporters (News Journal). "My understanding is that's not the rule." 

The fan clearly interfered with the ball, so ultimately it was the correct call. ESPN's Steve Berthiaume spoke with former Major League umpire Jim McKean, who told him that once the umpires decided to review whether it was a home run, the umpires could then use their judgement to rule on fan interference (Twitter).

According to the rule, the umpire can use his "sole discretion" in determining the use of replay, though Joe West told reporters the umpires were reviewing the home run (a charge Manuel denied), but that home plate umpire Chad Fairchild believed there was fan interference on the play. The second part of the matter was that the umpires ruled Pence out -- the Phillies outfielder didn't quite agree that Petersen was definitely making the catch.

"I'm going to say it's one of the best plays of the week if he makes it," Pence said (News Journal). 

Said Petersen: "I honestly don't know what happened. I thought I was going to catch the ball." (Sun-Sentinel)

The next Phillies batter after Pence, Raul Ibanez, doubled, which would have scored both Pence and Howard. Instead, after an intentional walk to load the bases, Wilson Valdez grounded into a double play to end the inning.

The Marlins then took the lead with a run in the bottom of the sixth inning with a run off of Roy Halladay.

Since the Phillies lost the game, Joe Torre will review the appeal. If Torre agrees the umpire erred, the game would be replayed from that at-bat -- but without Manuel, who was ejected. Here's a list of protested games that were later resumed, including, of course, the Pine Tar Game. No protest game has been replayed from the point of pretest since 1986 in a game between the Cardinals and Pirates.

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Comments

Since: May 15, 2009
Posted on: September 4, 2011 8:46 pm
 

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

How bout them Cubbies?



Since: Jul 9, 2009
Posted on: September 4, 2011 8:46 pm
 

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

Hooti, what does "here and here for a start" mean?
And I wouldn't be too quick to take Joe West's word for exactly what took place out there in the heat of the moment.  Even if he were remembering everything accurately--a big "if" to begin with--he has, for one thing, a certain reputation as a hothead himself (and self-promoter); there's even a website somewhere dedicated to getting him fired (I have nothing to do with that, by the way).  Second, as I understand it, it was Jack McKeon, not Charlie Manuel, who initiated the arguments, as West was going back to his position, saying that the double call should be called fan interference--and obviously he (McKeon) wasn't requesting it be called a home run. 
I suppose we--and the league--will have to wait to hear everyone's statements before drawing final conclusions as to who said what to whom.  But at this stage of their careers, if it comes down to a credibility contest between Charlie Manuel and Joe West, I'm not sure West would win.  Despite his supposed objectivity as an umpire, particularly given his reputation West can hardly be considered objective now, in this situation, since he's the one who may have messed up on the rules--a real no-no for umpires that could get him disciplined.



Since: Jul 26, 2009
Posted on: September 4, 2011 8:45 pm
 

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

2 for 12 with runners in scoring position only amplified this loss as well.  I have to be honest and say that I'm not lookin forward to the Braves series and hope to hell these games are rained out.  I just don't think that the phils are playing good ball right now, that coupled with the fact that the Braves came back today will have them coming in here ready for a fight against a team that basically gave the last two games of the roadtrip away to a basement dwelling team.



Since: Oct 26, 2009
Posted on: September 4, 2011 8:44 pm
 

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

the best part of the story is in the photo  - the woman on the far left, hiding behind a 10 year old kid



Since: Aug 31, 2011
Posted on: September 4, 2011 8:42 pm
 

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

If they want to keep these plays from going on, build the seats away from the field or have a railing or basket like wrigley.  Everybody goes to the ball game hoping to get a foul ball or home run ball so you can not blame the fans.  Even with replay, i'm going to try to stick my glove, hat or hand out to catch a ball hit by my team.  I would do that to help out my team and I want a homerun ball!   I think it is a joke to protest any game in the major leagues in the regular season and shouldn't have to in the post season unless you are playing the Yankees.  It is too bad that this game was delayed longer than it already was but it appears by the picture that they got the call right.  Looks like the home run was not even an option...either a double or an out. 



Since: Aug 4, 2011
Posted on: September 4, 2011 8:40 pm
 

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

joe west and david herndon are losers! 



Since: Jan 12, 2008
Posted on: September 4, 2011 8:37 pm
 

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

I'm not sure "lept" is a word.



Since: Oct 26, 2009
Posted on: September 4, 2011 8:36 pm
 

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

And Charlie Manual told a reporter after the game that he didn't even ask Joe West to look to see...
this isn't the NFL in the first 28 minutes of each half - they don't need someone to ask then to review the play. It often seems that way, since anytime there is a play worth reviewing, someone is going to argues immediately after the original call/miscall. But the umps can review on their own.

So someone in this loop is obvioously lying, I wonder who could it be?  Joe 'I don't like the Phils" West Maybe?
Joe West is a bad umpire, and a combative one, always picking fights when the discretion and selective deafness used by better umpires would be a smarter move. But his poor attitude and combativeness has been apparent to every team in the league, not just the Phils.



Since: Oct 26, 2009
Posted on: September 4, 2011 8:30 pm
 

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

also, there is   "I had two managers on the field," West said. "One of them was arguing that they wanted an out, and the other was arguing that he wanted a home run. Because they wanted me to go look because they wanted a home run, I got to judge whether it went over the fence or not.
to be fair, Manuel also said he did not know why they were reviewing the play - but he also said ""To me, my interpretation of it is he went to see if it was a home run or a double,"

And if that is the case, than the umpires can review - and if they see interference, they can call interference.



Since: Jul 26, 2009
Posted on: September 4, 2011 8:29 pm
 

Phillies protest loss to Marlins

And Charlie Manual told a reporter after the game that he didn't even ask Joe West to look to see if it was a home run.  Joe West decide after the Marlins manager came out to go look. So someone in this loop is obvioously lying, I wonder who could it be?  Joe 'I don't like the Phils" West Maybe?


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