Blog Entry

How would Seattle fare as a hockey market?

Posted on: February 16, 2012 11:32 am
Edited on: February 16, 2012 3:29 pm
An old Seattle Thunderbirds sweater. (

By Brian Stubits

With the news coming out of a plan in the works to build a new, state-of-the-art arena in Seattle, the conversation that was just talking for talking's sake about the NHL in Seattle has become a lot more real. All of a sudden it looks like an NHL-viable city.

I get the sense from reading my Twitter timeline, talking to other media members and seeing fan comments that the majority of people are excited about hockey moving to Seattle, that it'd be a fantastic place for the NHL.

However there are skeptics. The hockey community seems excited at the idea of Seattle having a team, but is Seattle excited? The apple of its eye with the new arena is getting the NBA's SuperSonics back. That's priority Nos. 1, 2 and 3.

While the man talking about building the new arena, Seattle native Chris Hansen, is focused on the NBA and has reportedly not talked to the NHL at all, that doesn't mean there isn't other interested parties who would like to work together. There's interest elsewhere according to Chris Daniels of King TV in Seattle.

So the question remains: Would Seattle be a good hockey market? 

Before I go any further I must disclose that I call the Puget Sound area home. I grew up 30 miles south of Seattle in Tacoma and know the region's sports passions and teams. I grew up a fan of the Mariners, Seahawks and Sonics.

With that out of the way, back to our regularly scheduled reading program.

The Puget Sound area, despite its proximity to Canada, is not a hockey hotbed. Although Seattle does have the distinction of being the first American city to hoist the Stanley Cup when the Seattle Metropolitans did it in 1917, it has never been home to an NHL franchise. It came close during the expansion era of the early 1990s, but obviously that didn't happen.

What it does have, though, is an appetite for hockey. Seattle has long had the Thunderbirds of the Western Hockey League. Tacoma has seen a couple of teams come through over the years in the WHL's Rockets and the Sabercats of the WCHL, which folded operations. Everett, to the north of Seattle, has a nice new arena that's home to the WHL's Silvertips.

Let's start with them, shall we? In the 2010-11 season, the Thunderbirds -- who now play in the suburb of Kent instead of Key Arena in Seattle -- averaged 4,096 fans per night. The Silvertips a short ways north of the city averaged 5,807 fans per game. That's a combined nearly 10,000 patrons per game for the local junior teams, assuming there's little to no overlap. That's not a bad start, especially for junior hockey, which isn't going to draw as much interest as the NHL.

Furthering the already established hockey presence in the Puget Sound area, Chris Peters of United States of Hockey mentions that the state of Washington already has a pretty strong rec hockey presence, and that's without any NHL roots. Plus, it's the 12th biggest media market in the USA.

Also, the state of Washington has more of an established hockey culture than most of the Sunbelt states the NHL expanded to in the 1990s. A lot of that is thanks to hockey’s nationwide growth in popularity over the last decade. So timing may also be in Seattle and the NHL’s favor in terms of projecting success.

There are nearly 8,000 USA Hockey registered hockey players (PDF) in Washington. It’s not a huge hockey-playing population, but it has consistently grown over the last 20 years. Since 1991, Washington’s USA Hockey player membership has grown by 234.1 percent. There has been a particular spike in growth at the 8 & Under age levels in the last five years, which mirrors what’s been happening across the country.

While the Silvertips are still new to the scene having really only Peter Mueller to speak of from the alumni list, the Thunderbirds do have some notable alumni who have gone on to the NHL. Chief among that group is San Jose Sharks forward Patrick Marleau, drafted out of Seattle with the No. 2 overall pick in 1997. He still has some impressions of playing in Seattle.

"Oh I loved it there," Marleau told with a smile overtaking his face. "I think they'd probably grasp it, take it and run with it. I think they have some great fans there."

But what kind of market would it be for the NHL?

"You never really know until it happens but I think there's definitely a market there," Marleau said. "There's definitely a lot of hockey that goes on there, minor-league hockey. A lot of teams close to the Canadian border too. Everything looks like it would work."

We've seen it in action and on a one-time basis recently and that worked out well. Prior to the 2009-10 season, the Coyotes and Tampa Bay Lightning played an exhibition game in Everett. The arena was packed with 7,281 fans excited to see NHL hockey.

Fans take in the Coyotes and Lightning in 2009 in Everett.

Everett GM Doug Soetaert -- a former member of the New York Rangers -- has little doubt hockey's top level would go over as smooth as freshly zambonied ice in the arena.

"In the right location, in a brand-new building, it would go very well," Soetaert told the Seattle Times in 2009.

There are some hockey fans on the Sound's south side. I attended a lot of games at the Tacoma Dome watching the Sabercats, that's where I fell in love with hockey. My dad and I would always just walk up and buy tickets to the game and walk in, no problem.

I remember one day in 1998 that was a lot more difficult than normal when the lines outside the arena were into the parking lot. That night more than 14,000 fans were in attendance for live hockey in the Puget Sound area. Minor professional hockey. I didn't enjoy my normal seats a couple rows up from the ice being relocated to the upper deck, but it was an experience. And a sign, I thought, that hockey fans do exist.

At their peak the Sabercats averaged 4,878 fans per game but the numbers did dwindle down to below 3,000 and the team folded before some of their WCHL brethren joined the ECHL (for those who are curious, the Idaho Steelheads, Alaska Aces and Bakersfield Condors were the survivors).

In general, Seattle is a good sports town. Not a great one, but a good one. It has taken soccer and run with it, just check out a Seattle Sounders game on TV. You'll think it's an English Premier League game until you watch a couple seconds of the on-pitch action.

I know a lot of people who swore off the NBA when the Sonics left town. They began hoping for a hockey team to take hold of. Some say they'll never go back to the NBA if Stern is still around, that's how deep the hatred was over the loss of the Sonics. No matter the reason, hockey has a chance to be a rebound. Some fans are just sitting in the unmanned crease waiting for the push.

Even still, hockey would be down the list of Seattle sports. It's possible it could be the sixth or seventh most popular ticket in town with the Mariners, Seahawks, Sonics 2.0, Sounders and University of Washington's football and basketball teams.

In reality, though, I don't think that means it couldn't work. There are few if any cities in the USA where the hockey team is the most popular. It doesn't mean it's not a good market for hockey. For example: the Red Sox, Patriots and arguably Celtics are all bigger than the Bruins in Boston. But would anybody even think of saying Boston isn't a good hockey market?

As Marleau said, we'll never know how well it would take to NHL hockey unless it happens and we can see it in action.

There are probably more hoping Seattle gets a team outside of the region than in it, particularly on the left coast.

"It'd be nice to have another West Coast team," Marleau pointed out. I bet the people of Seattle would agree.

As for what to call a team in Seattle? Join the converstaion on Facebook to check out some ideas.

More from Eye on Hockey

Seattle to unveil new arena plans
Daly: Group interested in NHL in Seattle

For more hockey news, rumors and analysis, follow @EyeOnHockey and @BrianStubitsNHL on Twitter.


Since: Aug 21, 2006
Posted on: February 17, 2012 7:13 pm

How would Seattle fare as a hockey market?

Seattle couldnt support an NBA team let alone an NHL team. Why is this even a thought?
Because Seattle could and did support an NBA team for four decades. Only the uninformed think Seattle didn't support the Sonics.

Since: Dec 19, 2009
Posted on: February 17, 2012 7:00 pm

How would Seattle fare as a hockey market?

I think a return to Quebec would make better sense!  Get the Nordiques back!   I LOVE THEIR OLD UNIs!!!!

Since: May 18, 2010
Posted on: February 17, 2012 4:57 pm

How would Seattle fare as a hockey market?

Could Seattle be a hockey market? Why not? Knowing Gary Bettman and his ways, he'll probably shove it down their throat. Like he did with Atlanta, Phoenix, and Columbus. If it doesn't work, a Canadian city may pick it up.

Since: Nov 28, 2006
Posted on: February 17, 2012 4:34 pm

How would Seattle fare as a hockey market?

Seattle couldnt support an NBA team let alone an NHL team. Why is this even a thought?

Since: Jan 18, 2012
Posted on: February 17, 2012 3:56 pm

How would Seattle fare as a hockey market?

I think it would be a great addition to the NHL.  One thing not mentoioned in article or by other posters is that Seattle did have a successful professional hockey team from from 1928-1931, 1933-1936 in 1936-1941 and 1944-1952 in the defunct Pacific Coast Hockey Leagiue and from 1952-1974 in the defunct professional WHL and from 1933-1936 in the Northwest Hockey League.  Seattle was in these league for entirety of their existence.  Unfortunately a few generations in the city have been deprived of hockey and perhaps lost to hockey because of the asbence of team in the city.  However, any that city that supported professional minor league hockey for 46 years and is suporting junior hockey now can surely support an NHL team.

Since: Jul 1, 2010
Posted on: February 17, 2012 11:07 am

How would Seattle fare as a hockey market?

It's going to depend on the owner.   If they market the brand for 7 or 8 years strong, including the year before the franchise gets there, they have a chance.   Otherwise, a franchise there will bleed money all over the place.   The arena is going to cost a fortune and operations costs are going to be very high.  It will be very tough to be profitable.    That being said, I think they will generate more revenue for the league than about 6 of the current franchises, maybe 9 or 10.    The TV market is strong and the sport is much easier to market in that region.  

Another city lobbying for a team will be good for the league no matter what happens.    I hope they build a large arena.

Since: Feb 21, 2008
Posted on: February 17, 2012 9:52 am

How would Seattle fare as a hockey market?

Winnipeg, by the way, is not a high risk market.  There are people lining up for tickets and can't get them.  Seattle would be a great place to put a team to fix a mistake like Phoenix.  Move Florida to Quebec or Hamilton and the fix would complete. 

Since: Mar 25, 2008
Posted on: February 17, 2012 9:42 am

How would Seattle fare as a hockey market?

Answer: very well. Seattle sports fans are raucous and loyal. This column establishes the deep roots of support for minor league hockey, and there's a well of fans to draw into the sport from the greater Seattle area.

Since: Jan 8, 2008
Posted on: February 17, 2012 9:19 am

How would Seattle fare as a hockey market?

Make it happen

 Take a team from a "warm-weather" area,
like say... florida, phoenix, etc...

and move them north,
to say... Seattle, Kansas City, or Portland...

Hockey in warm cities doesn't work (ie Florida Panthers, Phoenix Coyotes) as often as it does (Carolina Hurricanes)...
A lot of teams have had some success (Anaheim, LA, Dallas, Tampa Bay) but numbers drop as the teams performance drops...

My question is how far does attendance drop in a city like Toronto, Montreal, Boston, Detroit, New York R, Calgary, Edmonton, Vancouver... ?

I think the NHL should take a hint from the MLS as far as a rivalry goes: Portland Timbers, Seatle Sounders, and the Vancouver Whitecaps... 

Since: Aug 5, 2007
Posted on: February 17, 2012 9:12 am
This comment has been removed.

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