Blog Entry

Butler just killed some bubble team

Posted on: March 11, 2009 12:33 am

You want a list of teams that hate Butler right now?

It would start with Creighton.

And include Penn State.

And Arizona.

And Florida.

And Miami.

And Maryland.

And South Carolina.

And every other school resting on the bubble.


Because Butler's 57-54 loss to Cleveland State in Tuesday night's title game of the Horizon League tournament made the Horizon League a two-bid league, which means one of the 34 at-large bids must now go to Butler, which means one less bubble team will make the NCAA tournament. Put another way, the "last team in" Jerry Palm's Tuesday morning Projecting the Field was Saint Mary's. If you accept that as reality, Saint Mary's would now be out of the bracket, banished to the NIT, all because Butler missed 15 of 19 3-point attempts and lost a home game to a team it had already beaten twice.

That was good news for Cleveland State.

But bad news for Saint Mary's.

And Creighton.

And Arizona.

And Florida.

And Miami.

And Maryland.

And South Carolina.

And every other school resting on the bubble.

Category: NCAAB

Since: Sep 11, 2006
Posted on: March 11, 2009 11:35 am

Butler just killed some bubble team

The NCAA does not give automatic bids to the conference tournament champions.  The NCAA gives an automatic berth to the conference and the conference decides how to award that bid.  Originally, the ACC was the only conference giving the championship to a tournament winner while the rest of the nation awarded the bid to the regular season winner.  That meant the ACC played more games and made more money.  Once the NCAA started having at-large bids after NC State and Maryland battled in overtime, the NCAA realized they were leaving out some of the best teams because only one conference representative was included.  The NCAA tournament expanded and the conferences all started to add tournaments.  That maximized their ability to get multiple teams in.  A hot team at the end of the year could play their way in and give the conference a boost.

By the way, the Ivy League still selects its representative from the overall season and doesn't play a tournament.

Personally, I like having multiple bids available for the best basketball teams.  The conference champions of a lot of the conferences are "one and done" because they just don't have the talent.  But sometimes, when the moon shines full and the planets align, they play a near perfect game and pull off the upset (usually over Syracuse, but that is a different rant).  That is the fun of March Madness!


Since: Aug 19, 2006
Posted on: March 11, 2009 11:27 am

Butler just killed some bubble team

  all because Butler missed 15 of 19 3-point attempts and lost a home game to a team it had already beaten twice.

 Yes the Vikings lost twice to Butler. Both were by two points though. The last loss cavme with CSU up by 2 pts and Butler making a last second 3 pointer to win.

 CSU has proved they can play with a top 20 team.

Just ask Syracuse!




   As an SU fan I watched that entire game, and although I was entirely pissed off at the end with March-Madness like finish....there are some things I would like to point out here:


1) Cleveland ST has a bunch of guys who can scrap.  They play like they arent afraid of anyone's rep, and they play with intensity.  When

   they can dictate tempo, they can cause headaches for a lot of teams that are going to be in the tourny.

2) Really, I think Butler isnt as good as a lot of people who fluff the mid majors would like to think they are

3) Congratulations to Cleveland State for earning an automatic bid to the big dance.  I think they have a shot to shock some people in the tourny.


Butler will probably get in, but looking at their schedule it doesnt impress me with any real signature wins, 

I will say this, I am tired of hearing about St Mary's and Davidson, that crap is so last year.....they can go to the NIT and do their thing....

Since: Mar 11, 2009
Posted on: March 11, 2009 11:25 am

Rebuttle to idiots

 Ok so Butler has an awesome record, but they are one and done, especially if they can't shoot the threes (aka last night).  I hope i'm not the only one who saw the Bulldogs eek out those two Cleveland St. games or get embarassed by Loyola Chicago.  Butler is definitely one and done, previous tournaments don't matter for this tournament.

And Cleveland St. make a run?? Tennyskj, if you actually watched the tournament last year you would know San Diego won one game by one point in overtime, that's who I was comparing Cleveland St. to.  They have that ability to knock out one major team and surprise a nation but not past that first weekend. 

Since: Sep 22, 2006
Posted on: March 11, 2009 10:50 am

Butler just killed some bubble team

While this may be great for Cleveland State, and it may or may not squeeze out some "deserving" team like St. Mary's or (ahem) Miami, it points out the stupidity of the NCAA selection process.  As someone pointed out, the notion that automatic bids go to conference tournament winners is hardly the best way to ensure that the best teams get their shot.

I'd suggest that the NCAA start giving automatic bids to *regular season champions.*  That's right; reward a "body of work" instead of a three-game hot streak.  If the conferences still want to hold tournaments -- and they will, because those things are cash cows -- great and well.  It's a fine opportunity for teams to play themselves in, or improve their seed, or whatever.  But let's get the best teams in, shall we?

Now, I realize this runs the risk of making a mockery of the tournament--why, after all, would a team like say, Gonzaga, even bother playing hard and risking injury when it has already locked up a bid?  Yet teams like that have essentially locked up bids going into their tournament anyway, and they play pretty hard.  The conference, after all, can still award its championship in any fashion it deems fit --maybe the tournament winner is the co-champ, the outright champ ... whatever.

I think it's worth a look. 

Since: Feb 20, 2009
Posted on: March 11, 2009 10:08 am

Butler just killed some bubble team

As a Butler fan your "out on a limb" remarks are ignorant.  Ask opposing coaches how much Butler "sucks".  Our tournament record speaks for itself.  Bring on WKU.  Then come back on here when they are toast.



Since: Mar 13, 2007
Posted on: March 11, 2009 10:05 am

Butler just killed some bubble team

Yes,  but this Cleveland State squad could be a team to watch.  They are 12-2 since late January and beat Syracuse at Syracuse back in January.  I think you're right on Davidson.  They may not be the team they were last year.  Texas A&M could be a darkhorse to watch also.   

Since: Aug 29, 2006
Posted on: March 11, 2009 9:22 am

Butler just killed some bubble team

Might be the most absurd thing I have ver read.  Butler already needed a 3-pointer at the buzzer to beat CSU once this year and had to successfully defend a CSU triple at the buzzer in the other meeting.  These teams are obviously very evenly matched and it is not a surprise at all that CSU won.  To suggest or infer a fix because it's better for the Horizon league is just plain ignorant. 

Since: Mar 9, 2007
Posted on: March 11, 2009 9:13 am

Butler just killed some bubble team

I'm glad. The mid-majors will get one more in. Yes, to all of those that said that the Big Six conference tourneys don't matter, past the 2nd round. We all know that the Big Ten tourney championship doesn't matter. It gets played too late.



Since: Jan 14, 2008
Posted on: March 11, 2009 8:54 am

Butler just killed some bubble team

First off, I am generally in favor of mid majors getting a chance to dance...if they deserve it.  One, win your conference tournament.  Two, go out and play / beat some quality teams.  Gonzaga, Memphis, Butler, Xavier...all play a solid non conference schedule and in return have gotten respect from a lot of college basketball fans.  But before you sit here and whine about the mid majors being underated take a second to look how well they have favored in the tournament.  If you count Memphis as a mid-major, I think have have 2 final four apperances in the last 10+ years.  0 championships.  not a lot of sweet 16's and a lot less elite 8's. 


Since: Sep 18, 2006
Posted on: March 11, 2009 8:27 am

Butler just killed some bubble team


Idiots like you seem to pop up on the board year after year.  It's actually pretty laughable if you pay attention to it.  Butler sucks and is one-and-done?  Cleveland State may make a run?  Being that Butler has beaten Cleveland State 2 out of 3 games this year... your statements are already counter-intuitive.  They kinda make you sound naive, actually.

The fact is that Butler hasn't been one-and-done since 2000, when they lost in the first round to eventual runner-up Florida... by 1... on a Mike Miller runner... at the buzzer.  If you want to try to rip mid-majors... you'd have much better luck picking a team much worse than Butler (like a Wisconsin or Illinois, for example).

Have a good day. 

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