Blog Entry

The Poll Attacks

Posted on: March 1, 2010 4:37 pm
Edited on: March 1, 2010 9:47 pm
 

First things first: I knew Syracuse would be No. 1 in the AP and Coaches polls.

And guess what?

It's not stupid to have Syracuse No. 1.

It's a perfectly reasonable thing to do. I don't agree. But it's not irrational even though Kansas has just as many wins over fellow Top 25 teams and a better RPI, even though KU's two losses came on the road while Syracuse's came at home, even though Jerry Palm still has KU as the No. 1 overall seed. I could use most of that information -- and perhaps all of that information -- to try to convince you that it's stupid to rank Syracuse No. 1. But I'm not going to do that because that's never been the point. I don't think you're stupid if you think Syracuse should be No. 1; I think you're stupid if you think a good case can't also be made for Kansas.

But I'm over it.

I'm more worried about the coach voting Duke No. 1.

That guy is an idiot.

He's about to get Poll Attacked!

AP poll: If Syracuse fans think I'm stupid for having the Orange at No. 2, then I bet they think Tom Keegan is brain-dead. Keegan has the Orange third on his ballot behind Kansas and Kentucky. And did I mention Tom works for the newspaper in Lawrence, Kansas? Yep, the sports editor in Kansas ranked KU No. 1 and Syracuse No. 3. So please click this link and direct your hatred toward him, and forget about me. Thanks.

Coaches poll: It's OK to have Duke in the top four, projected as a No. 1 seed, whatever. All reasonable. But there is no way to reasonably put Duke ahead of both Kansas and Syracuse on a ballot like one coach did this week. Duke has a 25-4 record featuring a loss to North Carolina State. Meantime, Syracuse has a 27-2 record featuring no losses to non-NCAA tournament teams, and Kansas has a 27-2 record featuring no losses to non-NCAA tournament teams. So Syracuse and Kansas both have more wins than Duke, fewer losses than Duke, better wins than Duke, fewer questionable losses than Duke, and I could go on for days.

So who's the guilty coach?

No way of knowing.

Coaches ballots are private.

I can't see them.

But my guess is that the guy who voted Duke No. 1 is the same guy who voted Murray State No. 25 after a loss to Morehead State. Murray State is a great OVC team, but that doesn't translate to a Top 25 team, not when the Racers have four losses to unranked teams and just one win over a team ranked in the top 100 of the RPI.
Comments

Since: Sep 19, 2006
Posted on: March 2, 2010 12:00 am
 

The Poll Attacks

If you're going to hold narrow victories that Kansas had over Cornell and Memphis against them, you have to mention Syracuse's very close win against DePaul, who is waaaaay worse than either of those teams that played Kansas close. Cornell is a tournament team and was ranked earlier this year. And golly Memphis was the first game of the year. Yeah, they played horrible offensively, but they found a way to win. And again, a way better team than DePaul.



Since: Nov 24, 2009
Posted on: March 1, 2010 11:45 pm
 

The Poll Attacks

Sugarcoated?  Pitt is a very good team.  So is UL, who lost in double-OT @Pitt and lost a heartbreaker (on a bad call) at West Virginia.  Had they won those 2 games, they'd be ranked right now.

Beating Georgetown is a great win, especially since we did it twice.  Ask Duke and Villanova, whom were both dominated at Georgetown.

Kentucky hasn't beaten anyone.  They play in a crap conference and almost lost to UConn, the 12th place Big East team, and Vanderbilt, a team the 10th place Big East team did beat.

By the way, Kentucky has an SOS of 37.  That's pathetic.  And you lost to South Carolina, an NIT team.

Please, UK does not even warrant being in the discussion.



Since: Nov 24, 2009
Posted on: March 1, 2010 11:38 pm
 

The Poll Attacks

not the point at all.  Not saying it's KU's fault they have to play a lot of crappy teams, but it's also not Syracuse's fault they have to play a lot more good teams. Syracuse has a higher SOS for a reason.  They play more good teams that KU does.



Since: Nov 13, 2007
Posted on: March 1, 2010 11:35 pm
 

The Poll Attacks

2 home losses to Pitt and UL can't be sugar coated. Beating G'town is showing not to be such a big win. I wouldn't want to be #1 right now. You know what Carolina was ranked this time last year ? #5 ! This is perfect for Kentucky. Syracuse and Kansas can have the press. We get national headlines after Wall makes an off the cuff comment that suddenly is under national debate. I have never felt we learned more from a loss than this weekend. Judging by Wall's comments, the team gets it. I'll take talent over experience anyday.



Since: Oct 5, 2007
Posted on: March 1, 2010 11:35 pm
 

The Poll Attacks

Um, would the main reason that's the case be that they beat those teams when they played them? Should KU have said, we're gonna drop outta the Big12 this year and play in the Big East so a greater proportion of our games will be against teams in the RPI top 100? Maybe they should see about joining the NBAs midwest conference.



Since: Nov 24, 2009
Posted on: March 1, 2010 11:31 pm
 

The Poll Attacks

Sorry, but Duke has 4 losses.  In no way, do they deserve to be #1 over SU, KU or KU.  You can't justify it at all.



Since: Nov 24, 2009
Posted on: March 1, 2010 11:29 pm
 

The Poll Attacks

UNC was pretty good when we beat them.  They beat Ohio State and Michigan State, so they couldn't have been too bad, right?  Injuries have done them in.

Florida is an NCAA tournament team.  They have an RPI of 46, just ahead of #47 Cornell, who nearly beat KU in Lawrence.


I think the point is common opponents, Syracuse has fared better than KU. 

Cincinnati, the 10th place team in the Big East, has wins over the 2nd best ACC and SEC teams.  Our 12th place team nealry beat #3 UK and housed Texas, one of the best teams in the Big 12. Our 7th place team dominated Duke, the ACC's best team, and our 14th place team nearlry beat Duke in Cameron. You can point out KU beating Temple, but so did Georgetown.  Villanova losing a rivaly game to Temple is no surprise. 

BTW, I used "nearly beat" to illustrate that St. Johns, a bad Big East team, was competetive with Duke in Cameron, where most teams get blown out. 

And while I understand your point about "margin of victory", it's relevant because Kansas nearly lost to both Cornell and Memphis.  It's not just margin of victory.  Those teams were not competetive with Syracuse at all. 

Also, I wouldn't discount a team being a very good on the road and on neutral courts.  That means a lot come March.



Since: Oct 5, 2007
Posted on: March 1, 2010 11:24 pm
 

The Poll Attacks

Given that you feel justified in calling someone out as an idiot, then you're clearly an idiot. How can you honestly say it's idiotic to rank Duke 1 or two spots ahead of where they should be, when you, for example have Michigan State in the top 10? Who have they beaten again, away from home? Oh, right, Purdue, without Hummel, which artificially increases their RPI, which is still only in the 20s. For someone who mentions the importance of RPI, you don't seem to think it's that important. They have a losing record against the top 50, winning I think just one other on the road than this weeks debacle, yet their a top 10 team? that violates everything you mentioned when making a case against the guy who voted Duke one. Clearly you're an idiot, and a hypocrite. Is it simply that you just know about a few teams, and watch the first 5 minutes of SportsCenter to come up with this? Were you rejected by Duke?




Since: Nov 24, 2009
Posted on: March 1, 2010 11:16 pm
 

The Poll Attacks

7 of KU's 13 conference wins have come against teams with 100+ RPI.

Nebraska (136)
Iowa State (127)
Colorado (130)
Nebraska (136)
Iowa State (127)
Colorado (130)
Oklahoma (106)

Syracuse only had 4 of their conference wins against teams with 100+ RPI?

Rutgers (132)
DePaul (192)
Providence (114)
Providence (114)




Since: Nov 14, 2007
Posted on: March 1, 2010 11:09 pm
 

The Poll Attacks

Speaking of body of work and quality wins, where is Texas ranking these days? IF you want to discount beating a then top 10 UNC, you should probably do the same with Texas, huh? Please tell me Cuse fans are not trying to build up UNC and consider them equal to Texas. Texas may have slipped, but they didn't slide all the way to the bottom of their conference.

The UNC win was in November. I saw one Cuse fan brag about wins over Florida (NIT bound), UNC (CBI bound?) and California (NCAA / NIT bound). Wow those are some stellar wins.

Cincinnati, the 10th place team in the Big East, has wins over the 2nd best ACC and SEC teams.  Our 12th place team nealry beat #3 UK and housed Texas, one of the best teams in the Big 12. Our 7th place team dominated Duke, the ACC's best team, and our 14th place team nearlry beat Duke in Cameron. Since you're only pointing out highlights, do you remember a Big East team losing to Temple? And wasn't there a Big 12 team that beat Temple AT Temple?

I like how Big East fans have selective memory as if none of their conference teams have any bad losses. (Not that Temple is a bad loss, because it's not). I'm sure I could go through all the Big East team's schedules and find several bad losses. And "nearly beat" doesn't count in March.

Also, CuseyCuse, you keep talking about margin of victory and how you beat Cornell by more and Cal by more. Last time I check in March, margin of victory means shit. If you win you advance, so margin of victory means bunk in your argument. You can't use something has no relevance in March and then turn around and talk about how stuff doesn't matter in March (i.e. Winning all your Home games).


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