The truth

Enough with the Albert Pujols is all about the money comments..  If he was all about the money, he would have taken the offer from the Marlins which was for around $268 million / 10 years.  If anyone is all about the money, it's the greedy banker Nitwit Dewitt!!

All the Cardinals had to do was match the offer that they offered in spring training.  Last night there was a LONG conference call between Moz, Dewitt, Albert, DD, and Lozano.  The Angels, Marlins, and another team's offers were on the table - along with the
Cards (who happened to be the lowest of all offers).  Albert and DD wanted to stay and told the Nitwits that they just needed to come up a little higher than an offer of lower than $200 million.  All the Pujols camp wanted was the same offer that was offered in spring training, something a little higher.  BUT Nitwit pulled up his big boy britches and said that the offer stood.  He wasn't budging, basically saying LEAVE!  We don't need you.  He sat there and told the best player possibly in the history of MLB to WALK.  This runs pretty deep and I think friction between these 2 started 2-3 years ago.

So all of you people that know nothing of Albert and his family need to chill.  Dewitt didn't want him to stay.  You want to talk about loyalty?  What about paying the guy who help get you 2 world series rings since you bought the franchise for $170 million back 5-6 years ago.  And now the team is worth $600+ million??!!!  Are you kidding me?  Nitwit knows he's going to sell out almost every game. He's a banker.  He's got 2 rings.  He obviously thinks that Albert Pujols is not a big part of this franchise and that HE is.



This is a storied franchise, but Nitwit is nothing like Gussie.




Make sure you read the newspaper tomorrow.

Yall will be alright...your rotation will be healthy next year and very good... Plus you should be able to sign a good player like Rameirz or someone else now...isnt Albert..but your line up with them will still be good...

Yall just won the WS...And i still expect St Louis to be a top team next year even without Albert...seriously..hes a A+ type of player...but think about what you could do with 25-30mill a year...you could get TWO good players for that...

In the end the Cardinals might come out better..


Stay up St Louis 

Good luck 

Sportsjunkie, c'mon man you don't the truth either and I dont care what you think, it is all about the money and it is in every sport, MLB, NBA and NFL, there is no LOYALTY in sports, all he did is use the Marlins and Cardinals to get more money and thats that. You dont leave a team that you won 2 World Series with and been to 3 in the last 8 years unless it's about the money. What can you do with 250 million that you cant with 225 million. I am a Cardinals fan since 1971 and only a Pujols fan because he played for the Cards, I can only hope he sucks for the Angels and would not care if he had a career ending injury, no I dont wish anyone injured, I said "I would not care", he's not a Card anymore so lets move on and pick up a couple of players and get back and win another WS. God i wish we had a salary cap in baseball so the Yankees, Angels cold not buy a team to win, why even have the Pirates, Twins and other even in the league when they cant compete with salaries of these other teams.

**** Pujols!

Here's some truth:

Pujols didn't decline more money with the Marlins, he declined a refusal of a no-trade clause with the Marlins.

The Cardinals aren't at fault here. Albert Pujols is.

If Pujols truly wanted to be an angel, he should have re-signed with the Cardinals.  

I can't imagine what impact $250M makes vs. $220M in the life of someone who's willing to tell the team that gave him the opportunity to be enormously wealthy and the fans that made him that way, it's not about winning, it's not about family, it's not about dedication or appreciation, it's all about THE MONEY.  They should erect a statue of Albert Pujols in Busch Stadium, and have him posing with his middle finger showing his true attitude toward the people of St. Louis.

You need to be careful what you wish for, sometimes you get it.

The no-trade clause Pujols demanded and got in his Angels contract, also significantly implicates Pujols in the limitations of the Angels to pay a roster to put around him, for the rest of his career. Yep, I know...C.J. Wilson...and Weaver, Haren, Santana....but Tori Hunter and Vernon Wells, and who ? Maybe that last World Championship in St. Louis WILL forever haunt Pujols....maybe not. He got what he deserved and wanted, right ? We'll see.

As a diehard Reds fan, I always want my Reds to beat the Cardinals. It's only because the Cardinals are a great franchise and this is a tragedy out of their control that I visit this post to offer condolences. Cardinals fans deserved better.      

After taxes in Cali the money will be about the same as the Cards offered in the end...not everyone can be like Joe Mauer....

Believe what you want people.  But there was never a contract on the table for more than $200 million.  And all the Cardinals had to do was match the offer they gave in spring training and he would have stayed. 

Albert Pujols and his wife wanted to stay here.  And they were shocked that Dewitt basically did not want him.


If you honestly think that he's all about the money, you are way off.


Your owner is all about the money...



And the Marlins had the biggest pay day on the table, so if it's all about the money then he would have gone to Miami.


Pujols gave us 11 years and 2 world series rings...  Have a little class and respect.

Sportsjunkie is 100% correct.

This travesty is the Cards fault.  NOT Albert's!

Seriously what kind of chintzy offer is it to ask the best player in the game to accept money that only makes him the 3rd highest paid firstbasemen (Behind Howard, Texeria, and tied with Adrien Gonzalez)?

That's complete and blatant disrespect.

People say "It's always about the money and greed."

I'm sorry, but in this case I believe it's only about the money in the sense that the contract dollars are a reflection of how the team values and respects you.

When Albert says "It's not about the money." He simply means that its not about his purchasing power or what the extra 3-4 million a year can do for him and his family.  I believe his statement.

He went to the Angels because the Cardinals orginazation did not respect him enough to make him the highest paid player at his position even though he had played for essentially a huge discount his first 11 years.  

Most people can't understand this because they are blinded by the 0's in the contract.  We see $210M or $245M and are so far removed from that reality that we don't see a difference.  So we call it greed.

Think about it from this perspective:

Let's say you work as a Information Technology manager for a company.  The company doesn't do only information technology, so there are lots of other managers in that company.  Your department runs like a well oiled machine and year after year it produces the best ROI and provides the most value to the company of any department (not just IT).  By all measures, you are the best manager in not only IT, but in the entire company.  Unfortunately you are not the highest paid manager in the company. In fact there are 3 other IT managers who make more than you, and to make it worse all 3 of them have been at the company for less time than you!  So you go to the company CEO and say, "This situation needs to be rectified.  I am better than all of your managers, but make less than 3 of the managers in my own Division!  How bout you make me the highest paid manager in my own division?"  The CEO says "Well we'd love to pay you more than them, but in the long term it will eat into our huge profits if we do"  You stew.  You are offended. You feel disrespected. Another company is headhunting capable IT Managers.  They know your value.  They offer to hire you and make you their highest paid IT Manager.  Ohhhhh Respect.

That's what its about folks. 

And all the Cardinals had to do was match the offer they gave in spring training and he would have stayed. 

That I don't believe.

His wife went with him to LA on the road this season...it wasn't to watch the Cardinals and Dodgers play.  If it wasn't the money then what does it matter what the Cardinals offered...The St. Louis Cardinals are winners, always have been and always will be, before and after Albert...I say thanks AP and good luck, but you are not worth it.  I don't see him doing what he did here in LA and time will tell.  Money was more important to him just like a lot of people...as I said before, you can't expect everyone to be genuine like Joe Mauer.

That's what its about folks.

Did I tell them that I just wanted other, great managers around be so we could be the best in the business.  After they did that and we were unmatched as a company this year did I really mean that?  Did I decline an offer before the year started that as it turns out, I would supposedly have been happy with at the years end since my "divisions" numbers went down yet again...for the 3rd year in a row?  It was a good decision for my former employer to let me walk...especially since we won't be competing directly unless both companies get to the "IT World Series".

Did l tell them that I just wanted other, great managers around be so we could be the best in the business.  After they did that and we were unmatched as a company this year did I really mean that?

Sure. You wanted company succes. That doesn't change the fact that that you feel slighted by not having your contributions valued as they should be.

at the years end since my "divisions" numbers went down yet again...for the 3rd year in a row?

Yes my productivity was in a slight decline.  Was it a natural peak and valley?  Or actually a sign of the future?  Hard to tell, but the fact of the matter is you are still the best manager in the company.

It was a good decision for my former employer to let me walk...especially since we won't be competing directly unless both companies get to the "IT World Series".
 

Honestly, the point of my post was not to debate whether or not letting Albert walk was the right move.  We won't know the answer to that for 10 years .  My point was I don't believe this is about greed and money on Albert's side.  It is on the Cardinals side.  The Cardinals are a for profit company. 

Personally don't think that big of a contract would have crippled the Cards as much as some people believe.  The Cards rake profit.  Front load that contract for the next 4-5 years and they can still put up a competitive team on the back side.  Albert's marketing power and stature in the community would have been worth the extra that his onfield contributions lacked. You don't trade Babe Ruth! (or let him leave to the Angels) All in all I believe it was a poor business decision by the club.  Only time will tell.....

Personally don't think that big of a contract would have crippled the Cards as much as some people believe.

Having to pay a 38 year old 1B 25million (maybe more), is not a wise decision by any stretch, let alone a 39, 40, and 41yr old.

Babe Ruth was 24 (verified) when he went to the Yankees, not 31.

Whether it was DeWitt or whomever, I am glad we are not paying.  The reported 220M, that was on the table a couple days ago made me sick.  Yes, a great talent, and every bit worth 200M+, over the past 10 years.  NOT for the next 10.  I tend to believe what was being reported by the various news agencies, but if they are incorrect and we sat with our hands in our pockets, which I doubt, the end result is still that Pujols was paid for his past accomplishments, and I doubt he will be able to sustain those statistics. 

I would not be surprised to see him have a great year, or two, but it won't be too many seasons before we are reading and posting threads comparing Albert's stat line with the Angels to whomever we have playing at 1st base, and the contract sizes at those two players.

 

it won't be too many seasons before we are reading and posting threads comparing Albert's stat line with the Angels to whomever we have playing at 1st base, and the contract sizes at those two players.

I agree...As a Cardinal fan the relief then will far outweigh any regret.

I am more saddened about milestones than what we will miss season to season. His 500th and beyond...and the potential legacy he would have had here forever.

I feel sorry for all of the kids that are Pujols fans and got a huge dose of reality yesterday...they will be better bc of it for a lifetime.

I haven't seen his 40 yard dash times, lol, but the evidence is overwhelming that Albert's decline over the last two years is due to loss of a half step.  He never was a speed merchant, maybe average for a 1st sacker, and now he's slow, due to the aging process.  This is why he hits into so many double plays.  Also, his average is down, since he is getting fewer cheap infield singles.  I have never heard of a player regaining speed.  Once it is gone, its gone.

So, I would say he's worth about $17 or $18 million a season.  He created about 3/4 of the runs that Joey Votto did, but he's supposed to get paid much more?  Why?

He plays the easiest defensive position, and he created 107 runs.  Votto created 133.  Berkman created 113 runs, and Matt Holliday 87, even with all those injuries.

And all those other guys play a more difficult position defensively.  But Albert MUST get paid 50% more than any of them, for twice or three times as long?  That is the road to perdition.  You win championships by spending your finite amount of capital wisely, not lavishing it on  last decade's star. 

Albert WAS the best player in MLB, or very close to it.  Now he's not.  But I wish him well. 

Very well said pipefit...

If they don't get the production that he put up over the last 11 years for the next 8...there is no way it is even close to being a good move.  With him being as old as he is, I just do not see it.  We know you can't buy a championship.  LAA will know soon enough.  They will be the AL version of the Cubs before we know it.

By all measures, you are the best manager in not only IT, but in the entire company.  Unfortunately you are not the highest paid manager in the company.

You're making things too black and white when there's a rainbow of information.  You have been the best, manager, but you also signed a contract that said YOU AGREED to a certain compensation.  By the time your agreement was up, you were no longer performing at the same level.  You're still doing a great job, but clearly your value is declining (although you're still an asset).  For us to recoup your value, we have to spend money on other IT managers in the future so that you can continue to be successful, so we can give you a raise, but we can't bay you like the IT manager at Apple (a company that makes far more than us).


That's closer to what the situation is.

If he was all about the money, he would have taken the offer from the Marlins which was for around $268 million / 10 years 

Loria stated publicly (and Lozano echoed the sentiment) that their deal wasn't that much more than $220/10.  

 Albert and DD wanted to stay and told the Nitwits that they just needed to come up a little higher than an offer of lower than $200 million.

All news reports stated that it St. Louis was offering in the area of $220 million.  We were already offering him more than the $195 million reportedly offered in Spring Training.  If that's all he wanted, then why didn't he accept it before the season so we could have focused on the season instead of letting it linger?
 

Dewitt didn't want him to stay.

That statement is careless.  Dewitt (and myself) wouldn't want Pujols to stay for $25 million a year for the next 10 years.  The majority of MLB execs were polled and said that a 10 year deal in excess of 20 million a year would be organizational suicide for all but 3 or 4 teams.  We're far from the wealthiest 3 or 4 teams in baseball. 

But there was never a contract on the table for more than $200 million.

 It's already been confirmed by Mozeliak that they did offer him a contract north of $200 million.  

And the Marlins had the biggest pay day on the table, so if it's all about the money then he would have gone to Miami.

 According to Miami, they technically didn't offer him a contract larger than Anaheim's:
 

Team president David Samson denied reports that the Marlins offered Albert Pujols a near-record contract, saying the club's offer was worth a bit more than $200MM, 

He went to the Angels because the Cardinals orginazation did not respect him enough to make him the highest paid player at his position even though he had played for essentially a huge discount his first 11 years.

First, people need to stop saying he played for a discount for the last 11 years.  It's a joke.  A. No one put a gun to his head to accept. B. We bought out his arbitration years, which means we ended up paying him MORE than he would have made for those years, and in your first 3 seasons, all players make roughly the same amount of money under rookie contracts.  Second, you mentioned thinking about this as a business.  If you were my employee and I payed you X amount of dollars for your first 5 years, and you did a great job, but after 5 years, everyone starts producing less, then why would I pay you more for less productivity once that first 5 years are over?  From a business standpoint, it doesn't make sense.  I think anyone using simple logic, realizes that his BEST years are behind him (not saying he'll be terrible, just saying he's not going to get better than the past 11 years... or match them for that case).


Not sure if you're in business or not, but quick business/investment lesson: you pay for what product/investment will produce, not what it already has produced.  Stocks will initially go up when the Iphone 5 comes out next year, they aren't going to go up anytime soon because of the introduction of the first generation Ipod.  Sure the old Ipod got them where they are today, but that's not why people buy into the company.  YOU PAY FOR FUTURE RETURNS, NOT PAST RESULTS. 

 

I shouldn't say it's all Dewitt's fault either.


It's truly been a pissing match between the Albert Pujols and nitwit dewitt for the last 2 years and I am telling you Dewitt really didn't want him back. 

It is what it is.  But AP is not all about the money and he wanted to stay.


Again, all the Cardinals had to do was give him the same contract that was offered in Spring Training. 



All from a very, very good source.   And I am tired of all the BS I am hearing from the radio and TV people in STL kissing MOZ and Dewitt's a$$.



St. Louis lost a great man and his family. I just wish people could have a little more respect for a guy that gave his all for a decade and helped us win 2 World Series.

 I just wish people could have a little more respect for a guy that gave his all for a decade and helped us win 2 World Series.

...that when it was all said and done, left for MORE $$$$$$$. It will turn out to be a blessing for STL and LAA will have a few bad contracts on their hands in a short time.

All from a very, very good source.   And I am tired of all the BS I am hearing from the radio and TV people in STL kissing MOZ and Dewitt's a$$.

I'm going to go with what's reported.  So far everything that has been stated has been that we offered MORE than what was reportedly offered before ST, which was 9/$195.  The 10th year has been speculative, but all sources are saying it was 9 years with an average salary above $20 million.  Bob Nightengale of USA Today stated it was 9/$210, which gets him $23.3 MM a year.

 St. Louis lost a great man and his family. I just wish people could have a little more respect for a guy that gave his all for a decade and helped us win 2 World Series.

I have respect for Pujols.  I'm disappointed in his decision to leave for more money.  I'm even more disappointed in him if what you're saying is true and all we had to do was offer him 9/$195.  Why wouldn't he have accepted it before the season so we could focus a little better on the regular season instead of making it a spectacle (whether intentional or not).  If he didn't realize it was going to be a spectacle, then I'm sure glad he's good at baseball, b/c that kind of intelligence won't get you very far in the real world.


The thing that blows my mind, is that everyone said he should be paid more than anyone else, so then you look at the guys who are ahead of him; guys like A-Rod and Howard, and since they signed their massive deals, it's been widely agreed upon that those deals turned out to be TERRIBLE deals (it doesn't help that Howard will miss most, if not all of next season).  So if history tells us paying $25+ MM for you is a bad idea, why would we do it?  


I enjoyed his time here, I wish it could have come to a mutual agreement to keep him around, but things didn't work out.  I can't say I wish him luck, as I'm not an Angels fan.  I like the looks of Mike Trout, and I respect Jered Weaver for doing what Pujols wouldn't do for us (take below market price to stay in town), but other than that, I've never been a fan of them, and I always root for Felix Hernandez (hope Seattle either surrounds him with talent, or let him go).
 

9/$198 was offered at spring training.

9/$198 was offered a week ago and then that offer was pulled early this week.  Dewitt then had another offer on the table (and i don't know those details but it was lower) and all the pujols camp wanted was to go back to the 9/$198 and they would have stayed.  Dewitt stood by his offer.  The cards were 4th out of 4 teams of offers on the table.

Why did AP turn down the offer in spring training?  Remember, his agent and Albert Pujols waited for contract and it didn't happen so they were going to the open market and you can bet that his agent was drooling over this.  There is no doubt in my mind that his agent influenced him to go to LA as well.  I saw that coming back in June/July.


You can't always believe what you read on line or in the paper.  Alot of these media people speculate and come up with numbers just to get readers.  Do you believe everything CNN says?  Fox News?   They are geared to get ratings. 

And I'm not saying you have to believe me, but this is what went down.

It's over and done with but pay attention to the contracts dewitt delivers the next 2 years.  I would not be surprised if he sells the team in under 5 years.


We will see what happens.  Bottom line: we have 2 world titles since 2006 and that's alot better than zero.  We saw one of the greatest players in the history of baseball for a decade.  And saw some great baseball games.

I just feel blessed to know the man and his family. 

They will be missed.