Should Clips include Griffin for Howard?

 

think Blake Griffin is better than Howard RIGHT NOW on offense. 

Yes perhaps a tiny bit but when you factor in the amount of foul trouble Howard gets your team into similar numbers and you see that it is definitely a "perhaps".  Griffin is a slightly better scorer/playmaker though.

DH is better than Griffin on defense...

Yes a whole lot better

Griffin as only 1 block shy

Right that is 2.2 blocks for Howard to 1.0 for Griffin.  That is DOUBLE.  If Howard were seen as Griffin is seen by perimeter players he would probably have around 3.5 blocks a game.  But players dish the ball more and get scared when it comes to Howard being in the paint.  He is also great as a help defender just stopping the dribble penetration early and getting back to his man--very old school Ben Wallace in that respect. 

Good shot blockers impact is based on more than just the 2-3 they block but on changing shots and changing what the other team does.  Howard does that.  Griffin doesn't.  I mean if we want to just look at shot block numbers and how many shy player A is of player B then we have to say that since Griffin is 1.2 blocks per game shy of Dwight Howard and that Jason Terry at 0.2 blocks per game is only 0.8 blocks shy of Blake Griffin.  From there we can conclude that Griffin's shot blocking, shot altering/changing abilities are closer to that of Jason Terry than they are to Dwight Howard.  But I am not ready to say that because that is BS.  Griffin is a far better shot changer than Jason Terry just like Howard is far better than Griffin in this respect.

4 rebounds shy of Howard...

Again, we need to look at this exponentially and not just how many shy the guy is to the other guy.  Howard pulls about 35% more boards than Griffin does.  That is significant.  Griffin is a top notch rebounder too but Howard is just in another world from Griffin and just about everybody else.

Same with steals where Howard is 1.5 to 1.0 for Griffin.  That is 50% higher.  Not insignicant.  And yes I know that steals numbers can sometimes be indicative of gambling but this is not the case with Howard at all.  Griffin gambles more than he does.

Numbers only tell part of the story on defense and can sometimes lie but beyond the numbers Howard basically guards his own man plus controls the help area out to about 12-15 feet from the basket all over the court and he pulls a ton of defensive boards.  Griffin basically guards his man a little bit and sometimes not and gets and occassional athletic hustle block or steal and does get a fair amount of defensive boards but that is basically it.  There is no comparison between these two defensively and Howard is already better than Blake will ever get defensively (which is not a knock on Blake but just a fact).

Blake Griffin is in his 2nd year and can put the moves on you like the late Shaq

This is hilarious and doesn't even deserve comment.  They are totally different type of players and Griffin has nowhere near the impact of Shaq.

If you look at a guy with 2 years in league and he is playing as well as a guy 7  years in the league and he hasn't shown the immaturity or attitude issues of DH, why would you NOT think he is better.

Dwight Howard is still giving it his all on the court and just better right now.  If you are worried about some of Howard's pouting then that would be a legitimate concern paired with Griffin just being younger and having more room for growth but a reason to not make the trade is that Griffin is a better player and has more of an impact right now because he simply does not.

Clearly, your insight is on one game. 

No I have seen Griffin play more than just the Warriors but that game was my up close and personal.  Your insight seems to be on no games as you are comparing Griffin's offensive game to Shaq's when his game both qualitatively and quantitatively is highly dissimilar.

Dwight Howard also gives up layups when trying to block every shot.  So sometimes, double, isn't always better.  Griffin doesn't try to block every shot outta the stands.  He plays D and blocks when you should block.  Double..but only 1 more block....that is one less shot per game. Not really that impressive.

I didn't say Blake was a Shaq...I said he has footwork similar to Shaq..and he does.  Shaq did use strength but he also had great footwork.  Griffin has developed that footwork.  He can also dribble quite nicely and is a great passer.  All things DH cannot do.

Griffin rebounds with Jordan...  Howard is the only guy in the paint for the Magic.  Those four rebounds isn't a big deal.

All I can say is if you think DH is better than Griffin and you would trade them straight up...you are in the minority and for a very good reason.  That would be idiotic.

Interesting posts.  Both Griffin and Howard have unique abilities, but the bottom line is that there is more "up" side with Griffin, than there is with Howard.

No one will ever change everyone's opinions, but Griffin plays with passion and respect, whereas Howard seems to whine a whole lot these days.  Sure, everyone can relate to how frustrated Howard is with his current situation, but to attract a team who will spend major money for his services, Howard needs to be more professional and have the mindset of someone, like Griffin.

It would be interesting to see how Howard plays with a real "team" around him.  Howard seems to want the ball all the time, and if he was more versatile offensively, then I'd see no problem with it.  Griffin doesn't seem to "need" the ball in his hands all the time.  Griffin appears to not care if he scores 2 points or 32 points, as long as his team wins.  The same can't be said about Howard.

So let's do a "switch-er-roo" for a second.  Swap Howard and Griffin, hypothetically, and which of these guys would still be working hard and which is just going through the motions?  I'd say that Griffin would be busting his ass day in and day out, to do whatever he could to make the "Magic" a better team.  Would he be whining about the "non-call's" or the turnovers?  Yes, but not to the extent that Howard does.  Mind you, Howard would "love" his new supporting cast, but there would still be a problem, synergy wise.  Anyone would benefit from CP3 and Billups as teammates, but Howard might want the ball in his hands towards the end of the game, especially if the game is close.  Taking "orders" from CP3 or Billups might not sit well with Howard, whereas Griffin wouldn't care, as he'd just try to execute and be supportive of whomever he has to, on the Magic squad.

Should the Clippers trade Jordan and Griffin for Howard?!?  Oh hell no!  Howard, realistically, should look to go to the Nets (Brooklyn).  Howard and Deron Williams would make fans think of the old "Stockton-Malone" hook up in Utah (back in the day).  For Howard to land on the Nets squad, I would think the Magic would need to add a 3rd team to them mix, which allowed the Magic to land Gasol or Bynum, plus Humphries.  It would be insane to think that KH would remain on the Nets with D-Will and Howard.  Mind you, I wouldn't complain if that happened, but I doubt that it would.

I think it's great how the Clippers have emerged as an exciting squad in L.A.  Anyone trying to break up that squad is crazy and for once, the Clippers front office needs to just "say no" to all bids for Griffin.  It seems like there are pundants in the league who aren't into more balance in the league.  Change is good and folks need to let fledgling squads like the Clippers, Thunder and Grizzlies, develop, before looking to move their star talent to the larger market squads.

Bottom line ... Griffin and Jordan should stay put and Howard should stay in the "East".

All I can say is if you think DH is better than Griffin

He is better than Griffin right now that is exactly what I am saying

and you would trade them straight up

I am not sure that I would do that because of potential and possible attitude issues.  But those are the only reasons and not "Blake Griffin is better right now"--he isn't.

Dwight Howard also gives up layups when trying to block every shot. 

He does try to challenge every shot.  Typically you give up more layups when you don't try to challenge shots that is kind of how it works.  Just watch him play and then form an opinion please.

Griffin rebounds with Jordan...  Howard is the only guy in the paint for the Magic.  Those four rebounds isn't a big deal.

Right he is the only guy and doesn't have another big player to rebound with him yet both the Magic and the Clippers rebound percentage is at .504%.  So without even having another guy to help him do the bulk of the rebounding, Howard can get his team to rebound the same percentage as Griffin's team when Griffin has another guy to help out. 

That would be idiotic.

Idiotic would be trading Griffin for Charlie Villanueva.  Trading him for Dwight Howard would be a risk that may not help the team ultimately and make them a bit worse off but not "idiotic".  A word like "idiotic" is a strong word and in lieu of strong arguments strong words are often used but to say that a trade involving two great players like this would be "idiotic" on either side is just complete and utter hyperbole.