OSU Buckeye fans needed....

Ok, some of the coaches in the conference are complaining about Meyer's recruting tactics calling him "unethical" and "illegal."

When he was at Florida, OSU fans were pretty vocal on how much they hated Meyer and constantly ragged on his recruiting tactics, how many players were arrested, etc..

So, now that he is your coach, I really want to know... how do you feel about all this? 

Bump for that unethical coach ... 

By the way, I will trade you Musschamp for Meyer if you would like...

Well its pretty clear that the gold standard of college football is the SEC. The Big Ten is really behind the times. This isn't a gentalmens game anymore. Its about winning at all costs while staying within the guidlines of the NCAA. Guys like Meyer will bring a team like Ohio State to the next level. As a fan, I admit that I hated Meyer and maybe even called him a douche once or twice but I have definatley warmed up to him and really like the things he is saying. We will see if it translates on the field though. Jim Tressel was a control freak and was a little to loyal to bad coaches and average players at times. I like Meyers aproach that no freshman will be redshirted and no upper classmans job is safe. He is going to put the best players on the field. Tressel ball was very successful at times but is not the way to coach a game these days. Its kill or be killed and I think O-States offense is finally going to come to life over the next couple of years. I am excited to see what is going to happen this season.

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bucksalot,

I appreciate your honestly... nice post.  I couldn't agree more.  The gentlemen's game is a thing of past... I don't mind it.  I personally think the other B1G coaches need to get with the new era... and keep recruiting until the kid is actually enrolled and in the classroom.

The notion that "I got that kid to committ" so I was off doing other recruiting and "Meyer came along and stole him..." is idiotic logic in my book.

Now if they were paying the kids and made them sign a contract, that is different.  But as long as they want to call them "student athletes" then I feel they are free to change schools as many times as they can afford to within the rules. 

andy,

I hear you, but I also think we have to ackowledge posters like Bucksalot when they anteup and post quality material.... every group has it's undesireable fans, but we need to go out of our way more often to ackowledge those who are level headed and provide value added insight on these boards.

 

"OSU Buckeye fans needed...." .... to get laid?  (farm beasts don't count)

Thanks SEC official. I used to love this message board but it has largly been ruined by trolls. I love posting but its definatley hard to do that when threads are taken over by trolls.

It is an interesting discussion.

Ohio State is mired in the wake of its rather embarassing last year or so from "off the field" issues.

It seems a bit disingenunine that they would hire someone as "colorful" as Meyer.

He has a bit of a reputation of running a very "grey area" program.

I expected them to hire a squeaky clean square shooter guy.  Meyer is not that guy.  He pushes the limits.

It is all about winning.

Meyer will win games no doubt.

Bu this does take some of the "morality shine" off the usual Big 10 rhetoric.  

The Big 10 has always sort of looked down at some of the more "colorful" aspects of the southern football high stakes reality.

This shows that everybody is in the game to win.  There is no "morality" trophies.

Horns,

I get your point, but I think the issue revolves around what perspective you take and getting people aligned with what the incentives are,

Fans perspective:  You love your coach and hate others.  You are quick to point out anything you can to deconstruct the other team (whether it weak scehedules, weak OOC games, unethical coaches, etc..)

That perspective is what makes sports great, but it is not aligned with the incentives that drive the institution or the coach.

Institution / Coach:  Incentived to win, build the brand of the program, and ultimately make LOADS of cach.  The coaches contract is structured in such a way, that any critics should most like look to the administrators rather than the coach.   

And if the coaches practices were so far unethical, that kind of thing should be clearly stated in his/her contract.  But it isn't, because as long as the coach doesn't break the rules (black/white) then the University is ok.

So who is really to blame?  The NCAA... if the practices are illegal or unethical to the point of needed change, they are responsible for that.  Whether it is oversigning, stealing other coaches committments, etc..

So, I don't think ill of Meyer... I personally think the other B1G coaches need to pull the string and their Tamp and Man Up.

If I was a kid and had a full ride to Tennessee for basketball, and then Kentucky came knocking and told me not only did I have an opportunity to play, but potentially go pro and make millions... what do you think I would do?  Screw the committment... I am gone.

So, coaches aren't to blame here... it is the NCAA and the Administrators IF something is wrong.  And I am not sure anything is wrong.  The stealing other coaches committments which really haven't formally committed in writing is CRAP... until that kid is formally signed and enrolled, he isn't yours... so if you sat in his living room and made him and his family feel good about their choice, and then move on to the next kid and not continue showing the previous kid the respect and attention he needs... what did you think would happen?  
 

Bu this does take some of the "morality shine" off the usual Big 10 rhetoric.

Horns, 

One other thing... I agree with what you implied here.  The "morality shine" is 100% rhetoric.

I dont' think B1G fans will like what I have to say here, but it is the truth.

The "morality" and "ethics" arguments we hear go back is because they are trying to find anything and everything you can to deconstruct the other team and make them look bad.  So if you can't do it on the field... you are going to look to other excuses which MAY or MAY NOT make a bit of difference in the end...

For example, what do we hear about the SEC non-stop from anti-SEC people:

(1) We have a weak OOC schedule (reality, it doesn't matter, because our in conference schedule is hard enough per the system).
(2) Out coaches are unethical and cheat (reality, they operate within NCAA rules and the truth is many don't like the rules, but until you change their incentives OR force the NCAA to institute change, expect Saban to keep oversigning -- I don't blame him.  In fact I think other coaches are stupid for not playing on an even playing field until the rules are changed.  At the end of the day, the coaches in the B1G get ZERO credit for not oversigning... )
(3) Our players are thugs and get arrested... and the coaches are to blame (reality, the coaches can't baby sit these guys 24/7 and unfortunatley many of these top athletes come from rough areas where their persepctive on right and wrong is not mainstream -- so your choice is, take a chance on one of the best players in the nation knowing he is from the ghetto and has potential character issues, or recruit some midwest farmboy with good ethics but probably won't win you a NCG -- again, looks at the coaches incentive, what would you do?  I doubt Meyer has a clause in his contract that deducts pay for players who get arrested on thier own time).

Again, just my opinion... but I have nothing against Meyer, Saban, Miles, etc.. for operating in the rules.  I do however have a problem with JT and the organization when they know something is wrong and thy intentionally hide it.. .that is 1000x worse than anything the SEC coaches do.

I actually had been saying ever since OSU got rid of the Vest that they needed to make a statement with a big head coach.  I had two thoughts for head coach, one was Urban Meyer and the other was Jon Gruden.  Both are big names, and both are inspiring coaches that have an amazing passion for the game.  Then Meyer got the job and I was happy with things.  Then he created an amazing coaching staff and I was amazed!  I love his mentality that no one's job is safe and if you want to start or coach, you have to do everything in your power.  It brings the best in our players and coaches.  It will also bring OSU to a state of play that I have yet to experience while watching OSU football.  Woody Hayes may loose some sleep in his grave over this, but I think it's safe to say he would share the same passion as Meyer.  This upcoming season could not come any sooner!!

i just am prayin that he can stay alive long enough for the buckeyes to win another national title and maybe add another heisman
for braxton miller along the way. also i hope all those great steals he has been able to turn pan out as all-big10 stars which would 
only piss off bielema more and more and make osu fans even more happier if we could accomplish a brett bubba meltdown again..
and again... where brett starts to mumble uncontrolable in his messages to the media on camera. 

Instead of trying to cut and paste, I'm just going to reply and hope I hit the points I wanted to.


1st.  I guarantee you if the shoe was on the other foot, the Buckeye fans would be screaming bloody murder.   

Moving on...

Regardless of the rules, I think there needs to be a standard.   If there is a gentlemens agreement/understanding than that should mean something.   Obviously it's not an enforceable/punishable issue.  However, if there is a standard/expectation within an organization and you know it going in, then you should abide by that.   

There is a difference between how things are done in the Big Ten and the SEC.   Not saying one is more right than the other, they are different.  If you come in and poach recruits when there has been a gentelmen's agreement/understanding then don't cry when people are not happy with you/about it.

RR took heat for doing that when he first came in.   Obviously I understand the uniqueness of the position both RR and Urban ( and any other late season hire) were in coming in at the last minute.   

I guess my point is a standard needs to be a standard.   If the Big Ten really placed the same emphasis on football as the SEC, don't you think the Big Ten would change how it operates to mirror the SEC?   The Big Ten makes plenty of money off football as it is without winning NC's.  I see this as a mirror of our society.  Continually changing the standards because people just can't/refuse to follow them.

Though I did find it interesting that Barry Alvarez will talk to Delaney about Urban's recruiting practices.  

Dang preview function.

I do think recruits should be off limits (media, coaches, etc) the last 10-14 days prior to NSD.   Afterall they are kids and have been hammered for quite a while.  Let them have some peace going into NSD.  

1st.  I guarantee you if the shoe was on the other foot, the Buckeye fans would be screaming bloody murder. 

There's a difference between fans creaming bloody murder and a coach whining about a recruit getting flpped.  I didn't hear a word coming out of the Woody Hayes Athletic Center when Kyle Kalis decomitted from OSU and instead decided to go to Michigan.

Fat Bielema is a whiner.

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There's a difference between fans creaming bloody murder and a coach whining about a recruit getting flpped.  I didn't hear a word coming out of the Woody Hayes Athletic Center when Kyle Kalis decomitted from OSU and instead decided to go to Michigan.

Fat Bielema is a whiner.

Buck,

I agree 100%.  There are actually some issues going on in coaching that you can argue about (e.g. oversigning, etc..) but stealing players players who aren't 100% committed isn't one of them in my opinion.

This complaint is equivalent to a coach having his starters in during the lat quarter when they are up by 30 and the other coach complaining.  

My perspective to those coaches:  We don't care... Man Up.  Pull the string on your tamp and move on.