Not Any Time Soon

For quite some time I've said 2017

They're not outbidding the other huge payroll teams for Cano and Ellsbury.  Obviously they'd be perfect fits here given the needs of the team, but that's just going way too far in the other direction spending-wise.

MrB, Cano is getting a 100 mill contract and if Ellsbury stays healthy and plays up to his 5 tool ability he will also join the 100 mill club. I don't see Alderson and the Wilpons having 3 100 mill contracts and the team would be too lefty hitting in that scenario also. I agree both those players are offensive and gold glove defensive upgrades at their respective positions...JoeD

Joe...I don't think Ellsbury jumps from $9 million in 2013 to $20 million a year over a 5 year period...I can see him getting a 5 year deal for about $80 million...
As for Cano...his stats are almost mirrored to Wrights stats and he deserves the same deal...
I think the Mets...who will only have about $50 million guaranteed next year going in, can add these two players at about $33 million for 2014....They will replace Murphy and Nieuwenhuis in the lineup...so no LH batters will be added to the starting lineup.  Murphy and Kirk on the bench creates depth...Murphy can be a great utility guy as well as he can play 1B, 2B, 3B...

 They're not outbidding the other huge payroll teams for Cano and Ellsbury.  Obviously they'd be perfect fits here given the needs of the team, but that's just going way too far in the other direction spending-wise....thomas

Thomas...It will be time to make the move and they will have the money to outbid other teams, especially the Yankees...the Yankees are going to have to fill C, 2B, 3B, DH, CF, RF, SP, SP, Closer...and maybe SS if Jeter retires at 40...

This is the time for the move as I said...because the picture in the minors will be much clearer, the nucleus of the team will include D'Arnaud, Wheeler, Harvey, Niese, Davis, Tejada, Gee, Parnell, and Edgin...with Duda, Murphy, Nieuwenhuis, Mejia, Familia, and maybe Brown or Cowgill for depth...

To me...2014 is 1984 all over again...

Robby Cano's stats may mirror David Wright, but Cano is the top 2nd baseman in the game today.  Wright is in a group below Miguel Cabrera and is a corner IF.  The two are not both apples. 

Based on the Yankees lack of spending this offseason with obvious questions at C, closer, SP, and OF I think that they are serious about resetting the luxury tax formula by getting under 189 M threshold.  The one player that they may try and keep might be Cano and go low end in the other holes.  Then reload in 2015.  Or perhaps we will learn that Hal is not George. 

Maybe you are right Yogi but...what a coup it would be to get Cano to come across tot eh N.L. and the Mets...

I honestly can't imagine outbidding the Yankees for Cano.  It's just such an unlikely situation.  I'd also argue that Cano's numbers have consistently been better than Wright's.  Sure there's a ballpark effect going on there with HR being a lot easier in the Bronx but over the last four years he's hit over .300 each season with at least 25 HR, 100 runs and (except for 85 in 2009) at least 94 RBIs.  All at 2B.

I can't stand talking up anyone over there but the fact is that he's far and away the best hitting 2B over the last 4 (and you could argue 8) seasons.  That's a $25MM player and being home-grown by their organization a player they'll outbid anyone for I'd think. 

If Ellsbury comes back in 2013 and has a year like 2011 (.321-32-105 with 119 runs and 39 SB, 2nd in MVP voting) and appears healthy he'll get a substantial raise over $9MM.  Why not $20MM?  It's a risky $20MM but you're not getting that many places.

I'd hate the thought of bringing a Yankee on board no matter who it is. Yanks won't part with Cano yet anyway.

And the reason the Yankees aren't spending aside from the tax issue is because they already have so much tied into Sabathia, Texeirra and A-Rod, and the only one who's been somewhat living up to his pay is Sabathia. The Yankees are also an aging team, and I honestly think they know they don't have a chance at anything meaningful this year, realistically they're looking at a 3rd place finish in their division at best. I'd bet money on the Yankees missing the playoffs this season without even worrying about it.

I'm with you there ATW, just don't want their players over here in general.  That flies in the face of what they tend to like to do (Gooden, Strawberry, Cone etc.) but I don't care.  We might find that 2B isn't quite the need we thought it was by the time we're halfway through this season anyhow.  I was skeptical about Murphy initially but his first full year there looked pretty good.  Let's see how he handles more time.

You ask me Willie Randolph never fit in here either, even as just a manager. He's a Yankee. And the whole time he was here whenever the Mets were winning all you heard from Yankee fans was how "Willie was great and he's the reason the Mets are winning" and "he was a Yankee."  Then when the Mets started failing under weak Willie a couple years later those Yankee fans just went silent. Made me sick.

I don't want any Yankees or former Yankees here! 

Agreed completely.  The key for this team is to have their own identity, and part of that comes from keeping our own players here but also going outside the area to get anyone they bring in.  It's bad enough being in this town with a team that constantly wins and has crowing fans.  

Besides it doesn't really matter, both they and Boston will overpay to keep both Cano and Ellsbury around.  I wouldn't rule out Ellsbury depending on what kind of 2013 he has and what Boston has in the pipeline, but it'll still be very difficult to get him over here. 

The Mets aren't spending money and for those of you who believe in 2014 the vault doors are opening are on crack. Davis will get an offer next year for 50 for 5 if he hammers 30+ 90+ with a 260+ and that will be the big deal like Wright this year. The Wilpons owe a lot of money, the investors brought in have only allowed them to keep the daily operations functioning and the big settlement is coming due so like the logical few of us see, don't expect contention status for 3-4 more years. It doesn't matter anyway as the Nat's and Braves will be better for the next few years.

2016

1B Davis, 2B Cechinni, SS Tejada, 3B Wright , C d'Arnaud, RF Puello or FA, CF not in system and LF Nimmo.

Starters: Wheeler, Harvey, Niese, Fulmer and Matz/Urbina/FA.

Pen: Mateo, Mejia, Familia, Mazzoni from the right and Edgin, Leathersich, Kolarek, Gorski from the left.

Fact not all these prospects/players will be in those positions. Fact not everyone of these prospects will make it to the show. Fact even fewer of these prospects will be starters. Fact even less will turn into stars. Fact some of these guys will be traded, not resigned and incur injury.

Guys like Harper and Heyward will just be hitting their prime. There is the problem. 

113 players have worn the uniforms of both the Mets and Yankees (looked it up) most of whom appeared to be Mets first.  Certainly the Yankees ended up with former Mets that had better results across town.  It's subjective but the best we ever got from the Yankees were Jesse Gonder by way of the Orioles and Elliot Maddox via the Reds.

2016

1B Davis, 2B Cechinni, SS Tejada, 3B Wright , C d'Arnaud, RF Puello or FA, CF not in system and LF Nimmo.

Starters: Wheeler, Harvey, Niese, Fulmer and Matz/Urbina/FA.

Pen: Mateo, Mejia, Familia, Mazzoni from the right and Edgin, Leathersich, Kolarek, Gorski from the left.

Joe D says this is the 2016 Mets....this team does not compete for the playoffs...not even close

I'm with you there ATW, just don't want their players over here in general....thomasam

Let me get this straight thomas...you don't want the best 2B in baseball(by far), and an apparent future HOF player, should he even want to come here to this mess we call a franchise, because he is a Yankees player...

So I guess you hated Al Leiter when he was here too eh?

Sorry dude but, that is one of the most ridiculous things I have ever heard....

What did you have to search for one guy who played for the Yankees before coming here and being productive?  You can't honestly be comparing AL LEITER who played a couple of seasons there before going to Toronto and Florida for 10 years to Cano, who's played his whole all-star career over there.  THAT might be one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard.

That's right though, don't want to be saved by the yankees, no thanks.  I'll take a top OF instead and pay the $25MM there.  Sorry if you think that's insane, but I'm thinking you might not appreciate the rivalry the same way I do--and hey I might be alone there, I don't know.  Would you be OK having Jeter come here say a few years ago?  I guess a lot of fans would but not me.

 but I'm thinking you might not appreciate the rivalry the same way I do

Thomas, thats a crazy philosophy.  Lets use the Yankees as an example, but going the other way.  Do you think they had any issue bringing in Doc, Straw or Cone?  All Ex Mets (two of which were world series winners).

Do you think the Yankees had any issue bringing in Johnny Damon and tacking on another ring?

The yankees have the right idea on that one.  Rivals are people on other teams.  Once they don your uniform, they become teammates with a common goal.

One more from the Yankees.  Should they have skipped on getting Babe Ruth or Roger Maris because they were RedSox?

If you make my team better, I don't care where you come from, welcome aboard.  Especially if you're talking about a FA and theres no risk of a top prospect becoming a rivals future star.

That being said.  Cano, Cano wants too many years and too much money, so I pass on this one, but not because he's a Yankee.

Oh, I'm quite sure I'm in the minority there but I'm OK with it.  Maybe if the situation was reversed, where we had won 5 WS in the last 15 years and in the driver's seat it would be different but that's just the way I feel about it.  I also think it's what makes yankee and Met fans different and the two franchises different (in my mind at least).  They love to do that stuff, but I'd rather have players that aren't having their two NY careers compared constantly.

I will say in regards to Ruth and Maris though:  Ruth I think was an era where the rivalry was barely there.  It was a lot different when the Red Sox fell behind 26-0 or whatever in WS titles than it was in the 1920s.  However, Maris never played for the Red Sox, he was with the KC Athletics before coming to NY.

It's really a moot point anyhow though.  I find it almost impossible to picture the Yankees letting their cross-town rivals outbid them for an All-Star player in the prime of his career.  In many minds when Strawberry and Gooden came here they were done.  That's an entirely different situation than a player right in the heart of their career.

They love to do that stuff, but I'd rather have players that aren't having their two NY careers compared constantly.-thomasam



Even you will agree if the player(s) being compared were named; Willie McGee, Fred McGriff, Mike Lowell, Larry Gura, Jay Buhner or Ted Lilly you'd welcome these ex-yankees.  Players that the Yankees gave up on just a bit too soon.  They would also be players never invited to a Yankees old-timers day.   

However, Maris never played for the Red Sox, he was with the KC Athletics before coming to NY.

my bad - guess I need to go watch *61 again ;)

How did you feel when the Mets signed Galvine?  The Braves were the Mets biggest divisional rival at that point having won the division every time since switching over.  Would you have signed Cole Hamels if the Phillies hadn't extended him?  Is it a rival thing?  Or just a crosstown thing? 

I want a team that will win.  If the price is right, I don't think it should matter where the player comes from.  

In the end, you may be right, the Yankees might not let it happen, but that doesn't mean the Mets shouldn't try ... if the price is right.

Well OK I'll stand corrected.  I'm not going to fly in the face of logic I suppose, but I too remember the feelings when Randolph came over to manage that the Mets needed a yankee to get things right.  

I never felt quite comfortable with Glavine here to be honest.  Did I root for him while he was wearing the blue and orange?  Of course, but it still never felt quite right.  Hamels would be really strange given all of the anti-Met rhetoric.  It's a tough call there.

I suppose I'd be OK with Cano coming here (as long as no Met announcer says "Dontcha know, it's Robbie Cano" which I can't imagine happening anyhow).  I'd just much rather have a group of our own players lead us along with players who think of themselves as Mets first and don't have this "I always wanted to be a yankee but I'll play across town" feeling going on.