WITNESS

PER is a flawed statistic. Brook Lopez is 4th, Tim Duncan is 5th, Tony Parker is 7th. The best way to tell who's the best is to just watch them play. I'm not saying that Lebron isn't the best player in the league right now, because he is. I am saying however that he is not as good as his stats make him appear to be.

PER is an efficiency rating, and Lopez Duncan and I think Parker dont play a lot of minutes, and all 3 are playing great.

Hurricane you don't add anything except bragging about beating your dad up and stalking girls. Why don't you challenge more posters to fights LOL.

That's because Lebron is only a leader in the top five in only one of the six major catagories and only a top ten in two.  He's not dominating anything here - Not even in double doubles

But who has better overall numbers? Who is as high as he is in the five categories he is (points, rebounds, assists, steals, TS%)??

Tell me who historically has done more statistically and then I can see what you mean, because all you are saying is 'he doesnt lead everything,' which is impossible.

But who has better overall numbers? Who is as high as he is in the five categories he is (points, rebounds, assists, steals, TS%)??

Tell me who historically has done more statistically and then I can see what you mean, because all you are saying is 'he doesnt lead everything,' which is impossible

. 


Dude - he's not even in the top 40 in some of them and barely the top 10 in one or two of them. As far as historically better


Magic Johnson,


Kareem Adbul Jabaar


Kobe Bryant


Shaq Oneal


Larry Bird


Many others                  

Dude - he's not even in the top 40 in some of them and barely the top 10 in one or two of them. As far as historically better


Magic Johnson,


Kareem Adbul Jabaar


Kobe Bryant


Shaq Oneal


Larry Bird


Many others                  

You didn't address the point. You just listed names again. Find their total contributions in those five categories and show that they we're higher in the league at the time, in addition to PER.

This is seriously like reading about an argument between an adult and a 5 year old.

Lakers fans are even coming out and saying LeBron is the best in the league right now.  Yet, TLF continues to bang the drum that LeBron isn't even the 2nd best in the NBA. 

Yes, Laker fans, this (TLF) is your main representative on these boards.  If he were a Philly fan, I'd start bashing him because all it does is make a fanbase look bad.  Especially when he creates more threads than anyone on here.

You didn't address the point. You just listed names again. Find their total contributions in those five categories and show that they we're higher in the league at the time, in addition to PER. 

He wont address the point Jay.  I also see that now he has back tracked on saying Paul, Griffin, Durant and others are currently better than Lebron.  We say he is the best all around player to hit the NBA and he says "well so and so has more rebounds than Lebron does".  Disconnect somewhere or his Kobe shades are beginning to crack.

I would have to study a bit more on the per to see how the various groups came up with the rating to determine if the rating is a valid one. To be honest - I have never really considered it a valid rating any more then I do the fg% - because I haven't seen championships won in direct relation to the total, but obviously there is a lovefest for Lebrons genitals by all of you guys. I would point out that Kevin Durant is only seven-tenths of a percent lower then Lebron's per - so that would disqualify Lebron as a once in a generation type placer using your own standards.  A once in a generation would be defined as the only one to accomplish that in your lifetime - and Lebron isn't the only one even by your standards. I acknowledge Kobe isn't a high per - because he has a history of taking to many shots and not distributing the ball enough even though Kobe sits at the 6th sport in that position. 

PER is a flawed statistic. Brook Lopez is 4th, Tim Duncan is 5th, Tony Parker is 7th. The best way to tell who's the best is to just watch them play. I'm not saying that Lebron isn't the best player in the league right now, because he is. I am saying however that he is not as good as his stats make him appear to be.

It's not even that - it's it's based like the voodoo economics of George H W Bush - fabricated to make Lebron look good, but even if you take that rating and run with it - Kevin Durant is right there with Lebron - so then Lebron isn't the once in a generation type player because is not alone. 


Here is the thing about statistics that makes them flawed at times. Even though you have to rely on statistics for measuring the depth of players and comparing them - THE FACTORS THAT AFFECT THE OUTCOME HAVE TO BE CONSISTENT. Every game is different with the various factors that measures the success/failure being different. Temperamental referees calling the games different,  certain players having the game of his career, and players feeling good or bad, fatigue from back to back. Now I would argue that overcoming the diversity of these situations can be measured in the per but only to a certain point. 


You definitely cannot call Lebron the player of this generation using that statistic. If you are going measure by this generation - the Michael Jordan is in the same generation. If you want to call Lebron the player of this current NBA - I don't even agree with that because there are to many other players just as good.  Sorry to the Lebron lovers, but I just am not hanging to his nuts that way           

 I would point out that Kevin Durant is only seven-tenths of a percent lower then Lebron's per

And I would point out that Mathematics are another one of your weak skills... right next to judging NBA talent.

LeBron is in the upper echelon in every category there is. Of course he doesn't lead the league in rebounds... he plays on the PERIMETER. Of course he doesn't lead the league in assists he isnt a POINT GUARD. No he doesn't lead the league in scoring, but the guy who does averages 3 less assists per game and shoots nearly 5% lower!

You sit here and poke holes in lebrons game because he is 11th in assists like that is a bad thing? are you effing serious? he is a small forward!!!!!! He literally can do and does everything on the court. HE DOES EVERYTHING AT AN EXTREMELY HIGH LEVEL.

HOW ARE YOU NOT GRASPING THIS CONCEPT DUDE? Seriously. Lets go through this with you here are the guys you think are better than LeBron and their stats. AND KEEP IN MIND. Of all these guys LeBron is the best defensive player. He is the one that allows Miami to be so versatile which is something that cannot even be measured.

Per
LeBron: 30.8                                          1st among listed players
Durant: 29.1
Westbrook: 23.11 
Harden: 23.5
Griffin: 23.0
Duncan: 25.0
Kobe: 22.9


PPG              
LeBron: 26.9 4th in the NBA                   3rd amongst listed players
Durant: 29.1 1st in the NBA
Westbrook: 22.5 7th in the NBA
Harden: 26.0 5th in the NBA
Griffin: 18.4 17th in the NBA
Duncan: 17.3 29th in the NBA
Kobe: 27.4 3rd in the NBA.

Fg%
LeBron: 56% 8th in the NBA                   1st amongst listed players 
Durant: 51.6% 26th in the NBA
Westbrook: 42.3% 108th in the NBA 
Harden: 45.0% 74th in the NBA
Griffin:53.3% 16th in the NBA
Duncan: 50.5% 33rd in the NBA
Kobe: 46.3% 61st in the NBA

Adjusted Field goal percentage (accounts for the added value of making threes which equalizes the naturally lower percentage from distance)
LeBron: 59.8% 3rd in the NBA             1st amongst listed players
Durant: 57.0% 10th in the NBA
Westbrook: 45.6% 121st in the NBA
Harden: 50.7% 61st in the NBA
Griffin: 53.6% in the NBA
Duncan: 50.7% 61st in the NBA
Kobe: 50.6% 63rd in the NBA

3pt%
LeBron: 42% 17th in the NBA           2nd amongst listed players
Durant: 43% 9th in the NBA
Westbrook: 32.0% 118th in the NBA
Harden: 35.1% 88th in the NBA
Griffin: doesn't qualify
Duncan: doesn't qualify
Kobe: 33.1% 107th in the NBA

2pt% (in case you were wondering)
LeBron: 59.0% 4th in the NBA         1st amongst listed players
Durant: 54.5% 11th in the NBA
Westbrook: 45.0% 57th in the NBA
Harden: 49.8% 31st in the NBA
Griffin: 54.2% 13th in the NBA
Duncan: 50.6% 29th in the NBA
Kobe: 50.9% 26th in the NBA

RPG:
LeBron: 8.1 29th in the NBA             3rd amongst the listed players
Durant: 7.5 36th in the NBA
Westbrook: 5.3 91st in the NBA
Harden: 4.7 111th in the NBA
Griffin: 8.5 24th in the NBA
Duncan: 9.7 12th in the NBA
Kobe: 5.3 91st in the NBA

APG:
LeBron: 6.9 11th in the NBA              2nd amongst the listed players
Durant: 4.4 35th in the NBA
Westbrook: 8.1 5th in the NBA 
Harden: 5.7 22nd in the NBA
Griffin: 3.6 49th in the NBA
Duncan: 3.1 59th in the NBA 
Kobe: 5.3 25th in the NBA

SPG:
LeBron: 1.60 15th in the NBA         3rd amongst the listed players
Durant: 1.58 18th in the NBA
Westbrook: 1.96 3rd in the NBA
Harden: 1.9 7th in the NBA
Griffin: 1.48 26th in the NBA
Duncan: .8 98th in the NBA
Kobe: 1.41 30th in the NBA 

BPG:
LeBron: .87 49th in the NBA            3rd amongst the listed players
Durant: 1.2 26th in the NBA
Westbrook: .26 155th in the NBA
Harden: .49 102nd in the NBA
Griffin: .62 82nd in the NBA
Duncan: 2.7 3rd in the NBA
Kobe: .27 149th in the NBA

TOPG:
LeBron: 3.0                                         3rd amongst the listed players       
Durant: 3.2
Westbrook: 3.4
Harden: 3.7
Griffin: 2.3
Duncan: 2.0
Kobe: 3.4



Do you notice how even though LeBron may not be dominant in ONE specific category he consistently is one of the best in every category. Its called versatility. He can pass, he can score, he can board. he can defend. Now i know you struggle to understand this TLF since your lover boy Kobe only can do one thing at a time (either score or pass) but being able to do everything extremely effectively on a basketball court is a GOOD THING.

and again lets keep in mind that defensively there is much more to being a good defender than steals and blocks. LeBron has guarded every position on the court effectively, he locked up Al Jefferson for a whole 4th quarter and has also guarded CP3 and Kobe at times. No one else on this list (or in the NBA) has been able to do that. 

Yes, Laker fans, this (TLF) is your main representative on these boards.  If he were a Philly fan, I'd start bashing him because all it does is make a fanbase look bad.  Especially when he creates more threads than anyone on here

Sounds like you're butt hurt over my opinions, why don't you go home crying to your mommy like Lebron did a few years ago -lol   


To me, however if a player was in the top ten of 3 or more catagories - that would define him as one of the best  

Explain to all the nut-huggers of LeBron on here, including the majority of Laker fans, who else is as good as LeBron using factual statistical evidence.

To me, however if a player was in the top ten of 3 or more catagories - that would define him as one of the best  

Look above your post!  Now would you define him as the best?

Hockey sticks - your stats aren't real and ESPN's are quite different


Lebron sits at #4 in points per game for this year

Rebounds per game - Lebron is #25 for this year

Steals per game - Lebron is #11

Lebron isn't even in the top 25 in blocks per game this year

Lebron isn't even in the top 25 in steals per game this year   

Lebron is only #8 in field goal percentage this year

Lebron is #13 in 3point shots this year   

Lebron is # 13 in double doubles           



Dwight Howard, however is 5th in Field Goal Percentage,  Blocks per game this year and #1 in Rebounds per game. In fact I am beginning to see why so many say that Lebron doesn't play defense.


JUST THE FACTS           

This guy can't even comprehend text.  Unbelievable.

Look above your post!  Now would you define him as the best

Nope because his career averages are not indicative of what he is doing right now assuming those are the legitimate numbers for his career. I have seen his stats for this year and he is not in the top five in any of them except scoring and like Kobe he is not in the top ten in scoring efficiency known as field goal percentage. You're only has good as what you're doing right now.    

So your math stinks.  Your reading stinks.  Your talent judgement stinks. 


What are you doing on here again?  

I notice that only Laker fans and the stalker are so against Lebron, whereas every other fan of any team, not just the Heat but the Nets 76ers Spurts etc all pro Lebron. Wonder why...