NCAA and NBA farce.. Noel

After watching Noel get hurt last night I am just sick to my stomach for the kid.

On one hand the NCAA acts like these kids are "student athletes" which is probably true for a majority of sports in college, but not big-time sports at big programs.  The NBA wants the kids to wait to enter the NBA and forces them to play in college.

I also hear everyone debate the value of getting a college education...

But let's be honest, if this were 100% business (which it is for the NCAA and the schools behind the scenes) and you were faced with the following decision:

1. Play college, if you have a great year and avoid injury you possibly make tens of millions in the draft and 50-100MM in your lifetime... but you risk the chance of getting hurt and settling for a small insurance policy ($1-$2MM usually) or if you try to play you forfeit the insurance and may or may not make it.
2. Sit out a year and maybe you only get 60% of what you would have otherwise if you don't get injured (which is still more than most people make in a lifetime)... and have ZERO risk getting hurt.

What a joke... any kid you doesn't take the sure thing should have his head examined.  Once he has $50MM he can go back and get an education in a heartbeat.

And I do not believe that staying in college 1-2 years will make a difference with the kids who blow every dime ... that won't change.

We need to stop fooling ourselves.. this is a business.  Treat is accordingly and let the kids go make money if he wants to.

If I am Clowney @ SC ... I would sit out next year after watching what happened to Latimore and Noel... no way I play.  Spurrier should insist that he sit out if he had any morality.

What do you think?

 

Players with Noel's talent should seriously consider playing overseas for a year in lieu of a change to the current system.  Brandon Jennings went to Italy before getting drafted by the Bucks and he made $2 million in the process. 

Agreed, that is probably a good middle ground so they have something.

If you get hurt overseas, do those teams provide life-long support like the NBA does? 

I think there should be another choice for the poll: Strengthen the Minor League system. It seems to work for baseball.

However, gaining knowledge and discipline is never a bad idea. How many athletes have made tons of money and been conned into wasting it. Ali comes to mind, but there are many others.  Some business finance and accounting can be very useful, as just one example.

Tragic stuff last night...for Kentucky, CBB, the NBA and (of course) Noel.  While I understand and sympathize with your contention, re: players' choice...and certainly agree with the reality that both the CBB and NBA are "businesses"...I cannot help but think that any NBA GM would have real concerns about an immensely talented high schooler with scarey storky-thin legs making it in the NBA's arenas without "tempering/toughening" on CBB courts first.  Here's hoping the kid recovers, rehabilitates and strengthens his frame with another couple of years at Kentucky...then moves on to multi-brazillion dollar contracts in the NBA.

However, gaining knowledge and discipline is never a bad idea. How many athletes have made tons of money and been conned into wasting it. Ali comes to mind, but there are many others.  Some business finance and accounting can be very useful, as just one example.

I agree, but they don't take those courses... they take non-value added cupcake courses like Sports Physiology and other classes associated with questionable majors (Sociology, etc.).

This does suck! There are no bright sides to this one... does anyone even think he will be back this year????

I shouldn't say this but if his injury isn't that bad and he doesn't test the waters could you imagine next yr with the twins and Noel. Damn

This is obviously an unfortunate situation for Noel... my opinion is that if a kid is good enough to come in and compete right away then he should be able to go to the NBA.

Having said that, the NBA has wasted millions of dollars on kids who dominated the "no defense" AAU league and flopped once they got there. For every Kobe of Lebron there are coutless others who are now bagging groceries at the local gas station.

Also, as good as Noel is right now, I don't believe he would have been able to start on a single NBA team due to his lack of offense. Sure he could come in and protect the basket but he was a work in progress overall.

I don't have the perfect answer to this poll or question but anyone can get hurt doing anything... I just feel bad for the kid. He was doing what his teammates failed to do (play hard and run down a play) when he got hurt. I hope he recovers fully and quickly.

College is a great place for a young man trying to develop his game and his mind.  I don't buy into the premise that all, or even a large part of Jocks are not capable of learning.  Whatever time is spent in school is a good thing.  Noel will have his knee repaired and will eventually end up in the NBA.  that said, I agree with the above that he would not start for any team.  He is not big enough to play in the middle and as mentioned, he has no shooting skills away from the basket.  I was surprised to see reported on ESPN that he was projected to be the NR 1 pick.  Maybe it's me that is out of tune, but I would definately take Withy, Kadji, Plumlee, Burke, Murphy, Larkin, Fair, MCW, Kraft,  and many more before Noel.  I hope that all goes well for him and he comes back to Kentucky next year and becomes a better player. 

Does anyone really feel sorry for the NBA if they make a mistake on a college or high school prospect?  It's called a risk.  After seeing Noel go down last night I'm convinced that if a player is good enough out of high school to get drafted by the NBA, then why not let him go.  These stupid rules just cost this kid millions of dollars already.  You think he really cares about class anyway?  This injury will stir the pot all over again about these rules and I hope they are changed. 

AMEN BROHTER! Speak those words of truth!

This one and done crap has got to go! It doesn't benefit the college game or the kids who shouldn't be wasting their time playing in it for a year and risking losing $. I know it's the NBA's decision to change the rule but the NCAA needs to step up and make a case here and work something out with the NBA. Why not do something like the MLB draft? Go ahead and have a draft and pay the kids and tell them to go play college for at least 2 or 3 years and develop their skills and get an education whiile they're at it. Works pretty well for baseball. If it comes down to $ for the kids then make the NBA pay these kids ahead of schedule and take a risk rather than puttiing it all on a young kid's shoulders and also making the college game suffer at the hands of the all mighty $. It would really cut down on the dirty recruiting tactics too if the kids were already gettiing paid. The game would go back to being about what is most important...representing a university and playiing for a NCAA championship...not waiting for a year to move on without regard for the names on the front of the jerseys.

There is one aspect that is never mentioned when it comes to the on-and-done rule.

So many people blame the NBA for having the rule. But to me, just as much if not more blame goes towards those High Schools players (and their agents and families) that prior to the rule, flooded the NBA draft. There were so many players that had no business going into the draft out of high school to begin with prior to the rule. I am not trying to stick up for the NBA, but they have become somewhat of a scapegoat.

Now I will agree with what someone said earlier in this thread. I have said for a long time to structure a "minor league" system such as MLB has. Once they have established that, then I think it would greatly ease this argument.

Cardsmack..I don't have the answer for what I think should happen to these kids out of high school but no one should be forced to go to school if they are good enough to compete with other players making millions.  It's like someone being over qualified for a job.  These idiotic rules are in place so the universities get a piece of the pie and the NBA can get a better look of what they are getting.  The sad part is though it's all about money...and you would have to be stupid not to realize that. 

"Brandon Jennings went to Italy before getting drafted by the Bucks and he made $2 million in the process. "

Eh, his CONTRACT was for $1.2 million in salary and endorsements but it doesn't sound like that's what he was ever paid. Jennings has widely reported that it was the worst experience of his life and that he was only paid on time ONCE. His development as a player was stunted significantly.  

“My role is to play D and take open shots — that’s it,” he said. “And I’ve accepted that role.”

[http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/24/s
ports/basketball/24recruit.html?_r=0]

Maybe the guy instead should have gone to college, played like a star and come into the league as a much hotter star, get drafted higher than the #10 spot he went in and makes way more than $1.2 million in extra contract.

"After seeing Noel go down last night I'm convinced that if a player is good enough out of high school to get drafted by the NBA, then why not let him go.  "

Because every business has a right to define their business. If the NBA feels they are better protected by limiting the age of members, then that is their right. By all accounts, the NBA is flourishing these days so not having 18 years olds coming in hasn't hurt their business. It's not the job of the NBA to make sure these kids get some money as fast as possible.

"This injury will stir the pot all over again about these rules and I hope they are changed."

Me too. I hope they bump it out to three years instead of just one. My guess is that it goes out to two years in the next collective bargaining agreement.

I don't buy into the premise that all, or even a large part of Jocks are not capable of learning.  Whatever time is spent in school is a good thing.

Rune, 

In theory you are right, but in practice you are wrong 99% of the time.

I went to UF and played basketball (well, never played .. was mainly on the practice squad).  Every athlete there fit into one of two categories:

• Not big-time:  Treated school like most students and picked courses to get their degreee.
• Big-time athletes (and some not so big time):  These students thought school was a joke, took courses that the athletic directors picked for them because they knew they were easy like History of Education in Norman Hall, etc.  I took one of these courses one time with a bunch of football and basketball players I knew... it was ridiculous.  The notes were available before the class even started and covered everything on the exam.  And for the kids who still couldn't pass test when basically given the exam early, they had tutors that were required.

Again, I agree with you in theory, but it is very rare any of the atheletes who actually need the education get one.  You rarely see those type of kids in Finance 3408 or anything harder.  They take cupcake courses like Tennis, History of Education, etc. and trust me, they don't learn ANYTHING about real life in those courses.. they are filler of most college students, but they are core for these guys who have no intention of taking school seriously.

SEC-O 

"Cardsmack..I don't have the answer for what I think should happen to these kids out of high school but no one should be forced to go to school if they are good enough to compete with other players making millions."

No one is FORCING anyone to do anything. They don't have to go to college. They can stay home and train on their own dime if they want. They can go play professionally somewhere else. They aren't being forced to do anything.

If you are fully capable of performing open heart surgery, do you think it's "unfair" that a state still requires you to go to med school? I have great eye-hand coordination. I can memorize a section out of a medical book and remember what needs to be done step by step. Why can't I get a job at the hospital as a surgeon?

EVERY high level profession in the world has some type of entry requirements before you are eligible to get that job. Why would I have to go through a bunch of training as an apprentice to get a job as a plumber? I am fully capable of driving to a house and using a drain snake to clear out a sink clog. That's unfair!!!

"The sad part is though it's all about money...and you would have to be stupid not to realize that. "

Why is this a problem or sad? The NBA is a collection of organizations, of BUSINESSES. Do you have a job? Don't you want your company to make as much money as possible so you can be paid as much as possible? Guess what happens to professional sports leagues that aren't all about the money. They FAIL. Just like any other business fails when it doesn't make enough money. If my company doesn't make enough money they start FIRING PEOPLE. I would be pissed if it WASN"T all about the money. I need my job.

If you like the NBA and want to see it continue to thrive you should wrap your arms around it being as smart as possible about how it spends it's money. They aren't the NFL. They don't have a limitless supply of cash coming in. They do need to be smarter about what they do.

"I agree, but they don't take those courses... they take non-value added cupcake courses like Sports Physiology and other classes associated with questionable majors (Sociology, etc.)."

That's a HUGE stereotype and is largely innacurate. There are some student athletes that take BS degrees or BS courses, but there are also MASSIVE numbers of non-athlete undergrads that take BS degrees and every single college student in America has taken some BS classes. I took an Intro to Native American Studies class to fill a "minority studies" requirement that was such a joke I could have skipped the last test AND the final and still had enough points to get an A+ in the course. Don't act like that is unique to student-athletes.

My cousin played football at Maryland. Started 30+ games for them, so he wasn't some end of the bench scrub. He received his bachelor's degree in economics midway through his redshirt junior season. He transferred to Rutgers to finish out his eligiblity and left school well on his way to having his masters degree. While he is hoping to play football professionally, he is fully prepared for life after football. Don't assume that all these guys are taking basket weaving. Scholarship athletes have a higher overall GPA than the general student body. If the NBA had the same three year requirement as the NFL, the vast majority of these student athletes would find themselves in a better position overall. Better prepared for the rigors of the NBA schedule, more mature to handle the financial situation they will be in, more physically prepared to step in and contribute right away.

Even the great Kobe Bryant would have benefitted from a few years in college. He couldn't even beat out Nick Van Exel to get starts his first year in the league... Maybe a few years on a college campus learning life lessons from Coach K instead of a few years on the Lakers bench learning life lessons from a bunch of fellow 20 year olds and Kobe doesn't find himself in that Colorado hotel situation feeling like he deserves to take whatever he wants. Just a thought...

• Not big-time:  Treated school like most students and picked courses to get their degreee.
• Big-time athletes (and some not so big time):  These students thought school was a joke, took courses that the athletic directors picked for them because they knew they were easy like History of Education in Norman Hall, etc.  I took one of these courses one time with a bunch of football and basketball players I knew... it was ridiculous.  The notes were available before the class even started and covered everything on the exam.  And for the kids who still couldn't pass test when basically given the exam early, they had tutors that were required.

What are students at college to do? To prepare themselves to get a job in their field of their choice. They aren't there to be athletes.

What are the Big Time athletes there to do? To prepare themselves to get a job in their SPORT. They aren't there to be acoountants.

Why do you expect these two different groups to do the same types of classes? Why would the athletes take nasty hard classes that take a lot of time? That time just makes it harder for them to do what they are there to do. Do regular student athletes spend hours a day in the gym working out? Of course not. By why not? Because they aren't there to learn to be a pro athlete. They're there to learn to be a "pro" accountant. 

I went to school to get a degree in Management Information Systems (mix of Computer Science and Business basically). I needed some math and science courses as a requirement. I took a BS easy-a$$ college algebra and astronomy classes and got an A+ without having to put much time into it at all even though I could have taken much tougher courses. WHY? Because it allowed me to spend more time working at the classes I was there to do. HOW IS THIS DIFFERENT?

That's a HUGE stereotype and is largely innacurate

I am not saying among all athletes in general.  I am talking the superstar athletes who didn't have the high quality upbringing.

Like I said, I was at Florida in the years when they won the national championship in both football and basketball... I know what courses some of those guys took...I know how some struggled to even be in school there.

It is accurate.