And with the 5th overall pick the Lions...

I wish we had some assets (decent veterans towards the end of their careers) to sell off for some mid round picks. Like you guys are saying- this draft is deep, and we have tones of holes.

I'd look at moving guys like Scheffler and Hill for 4th or 5th round picks if anyone would bite on that. Pretty much trade any older vets with any value to shed $$ and load up in this deep draft... 

I'd look at moving guys like Scheffler and Hill for 4th or 5th round picks if anyone would bite on that.

Why Scheff?  He's really good and a big part of the offense.

I definitely like Scheff, but he's 30 years old and one of the few guys we can get any value out of.

I certainly wouldn't be giving him away- you're right that he's a good TE... 

You are correct he lost a year due to his knee coming out of college. He then got injured agan year two that set him back but last year he was healthy and never saw the field. Even when Backus missed time he didn't get reps as a backup.

I keep seeing this argument, but it just doesn't hold any water. Our top two OTs started all but one game. During the one start Backus missed, Reiff, our primary back-up made the start.

Tell me exactly when Fox was supposed to see the field? He was our 4th tackle last season, and we never had a need for our 4th tackle due to the play of the starters. 

At the end of the year you would think he would get a series or two to help Shwartz evaluate him.

I'd be on board with the argument that he should have got some playing time once we were eliminated from the playoff hunt, but apparently our idiot head coach doesn't believe in getting experience for younger players so they can help the team more during the next season, when it, you know, matters again. Nope- he's more concerned with trying to win meaningless December games with guys who won't even be on the roster in 2013. 

If other young guys were playing, then yes, you'd have a ligitimate point about Fox not getting any snaps. But none of the young guys we're going to have to count on this year got any snaps late last season. That's the problem with a coach like Schwartz who has an ego the size of Texas: he lets his pride over-ride sensible football decisions. His temper directly cost us the Thanksgiving game. For as much as I love the Lions, if another bad season gets Schwartz the boot, then I'm on board. He's doing nothing but wasting good years from Stafford and Megatron.

I don't think it's Lionized at all but the reality of the situation is he didn't play when healthy for a reason, he just isn't that good.

Again- Backus and Cherilus started every game but one, and they both played very well. Tell me where Fox was supposed to play? If he just wasn't that good he wouldn't still be on the team after two injury-lost seasons.

I would be totally dismayed with Mayhew if Reiff wasn't a starting tackle this season. The fact we would discuss him moving inside would be an indictment of the Lions scouting department and Mayhew's draft board.

This is another argument I keep seeing on here, and it also doesn't hold water.

If Reiff gets "moved" to RG, it will only be for this season until Jeff Backus retires and Reiff slides over to LT. On the surface it would seem to make more sense to put Reiff at RT for the year, but the plan is to have Reiff take over at LT, so it makes sense to let Fox or Hilliard take over on the right side so we don't have to have both Reiff and Fox/Hilliard starting at new positions next year.

Now if we draft Fisher at #5 that changes everything. Then Reiff becomes the starting RT and Fox is looking at a permanent move inside to RG... 

Our top two OTs started all but one game. During the one start Backus missed, Reiff, our primary back-up made the start.

I can't see how Fox could not have gotten a series to give Godsur or Backus a blow! Thats with Reiff as the primary backup. The problem could very well be the coaching but you would think three years is a good eneough time to know what you got. The Lions were 4-12 not 12-4 fighting for a playoff spot so the two scenerios are -

The coaching staff just blindly went forward with guys they felt deserved all the snaps or

Fox just wasn't very good and didn't deserve to be on the field!

Either one is just a bad situation it's the coaches fault for not seeing what they had or it was Fox being a bust, in all honesty I would prefer Fox to be a bust and are coaches be solid but I am thinking it may be the opposite.  


Tell me exactly when Fox was supposed to see the field?

After loss number 8 Fox should have been given a few series to see what they had as I mentioned earlier. Would it change the outcome of the season? 

If other young guys were playing, then yes, you'd have a ligitimate point about Fox not getting any snaps. But none of the young guys we're going to have to count on this year got any snaps late last season. 

I can agree with that one but it makes you wonder about Mayhew's drafting. Was it the staffs fault or were these guys just bust? I don't know and until they see the field nobody will unless what they have done on the practice field is horrific. All the spin is just media hype it's a shame we haven't caught a pro bowler late in the draft.  

Tell me where Fox was supposed to play? If he just wasn't that good he wouldn't still be on the team after two injury-lost seasons

Not sure but they kept Peterman on the team and I think we all agree he was a orange cone out there. 


If Reiff gets "moved" to RG, it will only be for this season until Jeff Backus retires and Reiff slides over to LT. On the surface it would seem to make more sense to put Reiff at RT for the year, but the plan is to have Reiff take over at LT, 

If Reiff is as good as everyone wants him to be he should be the RT if Backus comes back (LT if he doesn't). And that means they could afford to let Cherilous walk. If he isn't the real deal they try to resign Cherilous and have Backus come back. with the salary cap numbers it should be clear what they plan on doing with Reiff. And if that means resigning both Gods and bringing Backus back I would consider that a poor indication of where Reiff is. If they needed a guard I would have rather seen Decastro the pick. 

At this point in time it's not just Reiff that makes me question the scouting staff and Mayhew. Until they start really hitting some picks in the 2-6 range I have got to question them. 


Now if we draft Fisher at #5 that changes everything. Then Reiff becomes the starting RT and Fox is looking at a permanent move inside to RG... 

IMO if we draft Fisher then Reiff was not a solid pick as all we heard is he was the LT of the future. Thats not an indictment on Fisher he may be a probowler but we drated a LT last year. 

If they needed a guard I would have rather seen Decastro the pick.


Look on the bright side we can now get Warmack, who is even better than Decastro.  They shoud keep Reiff at RT.  IMO putting Reiff at G only slows down his development.

Sorry, I have not been keeping abreast of the Lion's draft picks.....but I thought a large section of fans here felt that the Lions should draft Denard Robinson with their first pick??????? A nice guy - leader in the clubhouse - lots of speed, etc, etc!

If they needed a guard I would have rather seen Decastro the pick.


Look on the bright side we can now get Warmack, who is even better than Decastro.  They shoud keep Reiff at RT.  IMO putting Reiff at G only slows down his development.

If we were picking in the teens, I would love to pick Warmack. It would be hard to pick him over one of those talented LT's though. There are three that are worthy of a top ten selection. Also, the Lions need a #1 cb badly. Also DE is too much of a black hole.

Agreed. Warmack would be a great pick, but it would be hard to take him over Joeckel, Fisher, Johnson or Milliner. If we do, I won't be disapointed if he's the pick, because the kid is a beast, but I think there are a handful of better picks out there.

One thing I will comment on, though, is that nobody should be surprised when we don't pick for need. They'll continue to draft BPA, just like always, so the need for a DE or CB doesn't come into play. Wright or wrong, that's the way it will happen, so focusing in on who will be the best remaining player available at #5 will give us the best idea of who will be taken, regardless of what holes we have on the roster...